Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me?

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Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me?

Post by orkan » Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:30 pm

Hello fellas. Looking for a bit of preemptive help here. I own 3 businesses, have two kids, and live in rural South Dakota. This means I am short on time, and have the need to drive through nasty mud in the summer and 2-3ft snow with 6ft drifts in the winter.

I recently went from this:
Image

To this:
Image

And I want to go to something like this:
Image

As said, I don't have the time, and I certainly don't have the knowledge or patience to get where I need to go myself. I liked my '05 with BDS 6" kit, but it lacked power even after new exhaust manifold, cold air intake, dual magnaflow exhaust, diablo programmer, etc. My '13 is quieter, much nicer interior, more comfortable seats, and the 6" BDS rides nice, but I lost some height and capability over my '05. Still doesn't have enough power either. First week I had the suspension, I drove into a ditch (on purpose) and snapped off the anti-sway links. That irritated me greatly.

Looking at getting a '14 or '15 power wagon. I need some travel for navigating steep ditches, and running high speed across fields. It needs to be bomb-proof tough for the same reasons. I see 90mph in fields sometimes. It needs to have power, which I'm hoping the new bigger hemi will give me... and if not perhaps a supercharger will help. The gears should help a lot too... since these two trucks were geared for 80yr old people.

2wagons1driveway's truck is my inspiration. I want a bumper like that or similar. I want an excellent suspension that can handle what I'm going to throw at it. I'll probably go with a white with red trim color package and I'll likely sticker it up with one of my companies logos. I'd like to find a shop within a thousand miles or so of me, that tricks out trucks on a daily basis and knows their job like the back of their hand. Looking for full suspension, possible exhaust work, programmer with tune, motometal 0961 20x10 wheels with nitto mud grappler 35's mounted and balanced, probably an intake and supercharger, bumper (probably front and rear), and whatever other little things may come up. I want to pull up, hand them my keys, and come back a few days later to pick up my completely finished rock-solid truck. Over here in podunk nowhere South Dakota, we do not have any shops that I can trust. At least none that I'm aware of. Most shops I've checked with have employees missing half their teeth, or don't have enough experience to even begin a project like this.

Any and all help you guys can provide, would be greatly appreciated.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by cruz » Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:54 pm

All I can say is WOW what a list, no help otherwise. And Welcome. :popcorn:
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by RAM4ROKS » Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:56 pm

A programmer of some sort- maybe Diablo sport Trinity? (I'm more of mechanical guy than a computer guy), headers, Y-pipe, freer flowing muffler, resonator delete (larger diameter exhaust the whole way), an intake, 5.13 gear swap, 6" Carli radius arms, axle truss, and some inner C gussets up front, Carli's as-yet unreleased rear suspension package, their "Unchained" shock package, hydro bumps, 17" wheels (preferably bead locked if you plan on turning at high speeds when zooming through fields at offroad tire pressures) 37" Toyo MTs. That'll handle what you ask of it!
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by fyrfytr704 » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:01 pm

If I were going to do this, I'd look into Carli or Thuren parts, Dodge Off Road has some serious suspension parts, too. With the wheel and tire you're considering, you don't need much lift at all (leveling would do it), but for the purpose of bombing through things at high-speed you need the lift in order to get the suspension travel you need to keep control and not kill yourself.

In terms of a shop, I don't have any specific recommendations, but I would also think that Carli or Thuren could give you an idea where to get things installed. Depending on how crazy you're planning to get, you're going to want to reinforce your front axle, steering, ball joints, and likely replace the unit bearings with a stronger free-spin type of kit.

In the power department, you'll have no issues. You can make power until you run out of money, for the most part. I'd probably have to know more about how you'll use the truck when you're not bombing through snow and fields at 90 to make any recommendations around how to get the power you'd want, reliably.
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by Ducky's Dad » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:03 pm

AEV

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by Cactus Red » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:08 pm

Ducky's Dad wrote:AEV


Yes...

Low lift, 40" tires.

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I'm just along for the ride...

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by Ducky's Dad » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:21 pm

6" lift is stupid and fugly for a truck that will be driven at high speeds off road. You need a smart turnkey shop like AEV, maybe KORE. You may need to order your truck and have it delivered to the shop for mods, then fly to pick it up or have it trailered to you. Plan on lots of money going into the project. If you decide to have it done locally, start with a shop like 4WP and work with them to get things done by the best available talent. And ditch the blingy wheels for something that will give you taller sidewalls and beadlocks of some sort. You might think about getting a 3G with the Cummins 5.9 and starting with that as your platform. 3Gs have a lot of offroad advantages over the 4G, but the 4Gs are nicer. The Cummins is heavy and not as good in mud and snow as the Hemi, but it's easier to build big power.

Geared for 80 year olds? Don't think so.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by RAM4ROKS » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:36 pm

Ducky's Dad wrote:6" lift is stupid and fugly for a truck that will be driven at high speeds off road. You need a smart turnkey shop like AEV, maybe KORE. You may need to order your truck and have it delivered to the shop for mods, then fly to pick it up or have it trailered to you. Plan on lots of money going into the project. If you decide to have it done locally, start with a shop like 4WP and work with them to get things done by the best available talent. And ditch the blingy wheels for something that will give you taller sidewalls and beadlocks of some sort. You might think about getting a 3G with the Cummins 5.9 and starting with that as your platform. 3Gs have a lot of offroad advantages over the 4G, but the 4Gs are nicer. The Cummins is heavy and not as good in mud and snow as the Hemi, but it's easier to build big power.

Geared for 80 year olds? Don't think so.
I used to 100% agree that 6" lift is stupid for high speed BUT, have you watched Carli's vids??? Those truck haul @$$ on 6" lifts!!!! I'd add one or more of Carli's and Thuren's authorized shops to the list. Other than that, I agree with you! (especially on keeping well away from blingy 20" wheels! Yikes!)

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by Ducky's Dad » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:53 pm

I used to 100% agree that 6" lift is stupid for high speed
All the Carli vids that I have seen have been prerunner stuff in the desert. That's a whole lot different than snow and mud and 90mph in open fields. The only legitimate reasons for big lifts are to gain ground clearance under the pumpkins by fitting taller tires and still having enough room in the fenders for wheel travel. No amount of lift will change the height of the pumpkins, only tires can do that unless you change the axles. AEV solves that with the aforementioned mild lift and big fenders to fit taller tires. 6" lift completely screws the truck's center of gravity and ability to sidehill with any degree of confidence. Doesn't mean you can't go fast with a 6" lift, but you can go faster safer with a shorter lift. If you want to get really trick, look into some of the arctic expedition vehicles with fat flotation tires and mild lifts. Not real good for the go-fast stuff, but will get you in and out of some mucky stuff.

And for the OP's benefit, I freely admit that I am a curmudgeon and a bit old school when it comes to this stuff. Use what works and skip the trendy crap, unless you need to add bling for advertising the business. If that is the case, think about a vinyl wrap rather than fancy wheels.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by adeluca73 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:48 am

orkan wrote:Hello fellas. Looking for a bit of preemptive help here. I own 3 businesses, have two kids, and live in rural South Dakota. This means I am short on time, and have the need to drive through nasty mud in the summer and 2-3ft snow with 6ft drifts in the winter.

I recently went from this:
Image

To this:
Image

And I want to go to something like this:
Image

As said, I don't have the time, and I certainly don't have the knowledge or patience to get where I need to go myself. I liked my '05 with BDS 6" kit, but it lacked power even after new exhaust manifold, cold air intake, dual magnaflow exhaust, diablo programmer, etc. My '13 is quieter, much nicer interior, more comfortable seats, and the 6" BDS rides nice, but I lost some height and capability over my '05. Still doesn't have enough power either. First week I had the suspension, I drove into a ditch (on purpose) and snapped off the anti-sway links. That irritated me greatly.

Looking at getting a '14 or '15 power wagon. I need some travel for navigating steep ditches, and running high speed across fields. It needs to be bomb-proof tough for the same reasons. I see 90mph in fields sometimes. It needs to have power, which I'm hoping the new bigger hemi will give me... and if not perhaps a supercharger will help. The gears should help a lot too... since these two trucks were geared for 80yr old people.

2wagons1driveway's truck is my inspiration. I want a bumper like that or similar. I want an excellent suspension that can handle what I'm going to throw at it. I'll probably go with a white with red trim color package and I'll likely sticker it up with one of my companies logos. I'd like to find a shop within a thousand miles or so of me, that tricks out trucks on a daily basis and knows their job like the back of their hand. Looking for full suspension, possible exhaust work, programmer with tune, motometal 0961 20x10 wheels with nitto mud grappler 35's mounted and balanced, probably an intake and supercharger, bumper (probably front and rear), and whatever other little things may come up. I want to pull up, hand them my keys, and come back a few days later to pick up my completely finished rock-solid truck. Over here in podunk nowhere South Dakota, we do not have any shops that I can trust. At least none that I'm aware of. Most shops I've checked with have employees missing half their teeth, or don't have enough experience to even begin a project like this.

Any and all help you guys can provide, would be greatly appreciated.

Where can I sign up for a business that requires a truck like that for daily ops, geeze! :jawdrop:
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by azracer » Wed Jul 16, 2014 1:09 am

The Carli 6" or Thuren Alien Arms 3>6" kits are all about wheel travel and approach, departure and break over angle. The reason 37" tires are the biggest they use is because of the axles, steering and their being the week link in our trucks. The biggest tire our axles can safely handle due to weight and leverage is 37" Those running 40" tires hard and fast will break something sooner or later if run at high speeds and rough conditions. There is a reason Carli and Thuren base their full on stuff on a 37" tire. That said one can get away with 40" tires for a long time with common sense and controled abuse. Even when run hard it may be some time before something breaks but rest assured it will break something.
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by 05PWrockcrawler » Wed Jul 16, 2014 7:01 am

We will see my truck gets abused with 40" tires. But of course I have spent a ton of money on good quality parts to make it last. I'm excited to se this build. My suggestion is full Carli or Thuren suspension. Very very happy with my Thuren setup. Hey and my truck feels pretty damn stable with over 6" of lift and 40" tires. Wish I had lower gears and more power. Besides suspension I would add a supercharger and lower gears and it would wake that truck up big time. Also if your gonna run 20" rims you need at least 37" tires for my rubber when bouncing around in rough terrain at 90 mph. Not to mention bigger rim less rubber harsher ride. Good luck with the build. Call Don Thuren and I am sure he can hook you up plus knows a badass shop that can do all this work for you. Good luck with build.


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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by 08TwinStickPW » Wed Jul 16, 2014 7:48 am

Well...I hate to say it but if your blasting through fields at 90mph (and high speed off road is main offroad use) why not just get a Raptor?

I know, I know, flame suit on.
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by SheepdogOutdoorsman » Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:32 am

You could also opt for axle portals ... That would give you diff clearance while keeping your lift mild on big tires
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by SheepdogOutdoorsman » Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:33 am

08TwinStickPW wrote:Well...I hate to say it but if your blasting through fields at 90mph (and high speed off road is main offroad use) why not just get a Raptor?

I know, I know, flame suit on.
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by MOPARManiac » Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:03 am

08TwinStickPW wrote:Well...I hate to say it but if your blasting through fields at 90mph (and high speed off road is main offroad use) why not just get a Raptor?

I know, I know, flame suit on.
90 MPH in fields............I call B.S. Will you be going with the rows or across? :roll: If it is pasture land you have a death wish as you can't see or negotiate every rut, hole, etc. You will be either dead or picking up your front end 200 feet behind you. Enjoy the repairs and medical bills.
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by 04Ram2500Hemi » Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:54 am

Ducky's Dad wrote:AEV
I agree, whenever they decide to release their stuff.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by Ducky's Dad » Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:13 am

Well...I hate to say it but if your blasting through fields at 90mph (and high speed off road is main offroad use) why not just get a Raptor?

I know, I know, flame suit on.
Yeah, get a Rapturd. Ford engineers protected the front end components by making the frame the weak point.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by orkan » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:44 pm

MOPARManiac wrote:90 MPH in fields............I call B.S. Will you be going with the rows or across? :roll: If it is pasture land you have a death wish as you can't see or negotiate every rut, hole, etc. You will be either dead or picking up your front end 200 feet behind you. Enjoy the repairs and medical bills.
Been doing it for 20 years... and I am fine. Your concern for my welfare is touching though. I see this is a point of contention with some, so allow me to explain.

Where I live, it is corn fields, wheat fields, and bean fields as far as the eye can see. They are nice and flat and cultivated. I have lived here all my life, so I know every inch of every field I run in. Going cross corn rows is rough... but not too bad most of the time. The faster you go, the smoother it is. :) I live 18 miles from my work, so I go at least to and from once every day.

When I'm driving to or from work, and I see one of these:
Image

I put him in here:
Image

Then on the weekends I go coyote calling, and spend a lot of time off road smashing through huge drifts and snowed up fields to get to within walking distance of our sets. When we see one between sets in an open field with no fences, he gets taken out with horsepower. This is kind of what we do around here, and I've been doing it since I was a kid. My neighbors that run cattle try to give me money, plow my driveway, and do favors for me based on the fact that I protect their livelihood year round from vermin and predators. If you like, I can go out and get some video of me running 100mph + in a field. I'm sure it won't matter as I find that negative-types on forums are rarely satiated. Suffice it to say that I don't live where you live... and I wouldn't presume to tell you what you are or are not capable of in your AO. Two different Dodge 1500's with 6" BDS lifts, and I have not once felt like I was in danger of ending up on my lid. It's called knowing how to drive. As I said, I don't know how to build them, but I can drive them.

For the rest of you, I'm VERY thankful for your contributions. I am the first to admit that my set of circumstances are unique... and trucks like this aren't all together "necessary" most of the time, but I want what I want. The 6" lift is required to clear 35's at full compression when I do find myself jumping a drainage ditch or a train track. If I could go with a lower lift, and find someone to baja out my fenders to avoid hitting/cutting... then maybe I'd go that route. ... but it still wouldn't help navigating the ditches, when I found myself high centered at factory height all the time. Also, my pumpkins can be in the snow, but once my body hits... I'm stuck.
Image

Winter often looks like this. Yeah, there's a road there somewhere. Tell me you wouldn't have fun racing around in that field... ;)
Image

A friend of mine has a raptor. I'm not interested. Not even a little bit.

I've looked at all of the companies you guys mentioned. It all looks amazing, and I don't even know where to begin choosing... since I have no clue what it is capable of compared to my 6" BDS kits I'm familiar with. Unfortunately I'm still no closer to finding a shop that can hand-hold a complete mechanical moron like I am. I worked on all my trucks when I was in high school and a bit after. It was fun learning... but these new trucks with all the computers and sensors... I don't have the time or desire to learn how to do it right. Nor do I have the time to do the work even if I did.

I know I don't want to go with larger than 35" tires. These mud grapplers are heavy enough, and with the beating I give them, I can't see any front end being able to take 37's and certainly not 40's. Also, after driving a few friends rigs with 37's, I don't think I like the extra "spongy-ness" that they give. It makes it far less responsive when tearing around at high speeds. 35's on 20's are just right for me.

Adeluca, in regard to what business you need to get into, I spend most of my time with Primal Rights these days. www.primalrights.com We are a precision rifle and accessory sales and training company. I get to go afield and "test" all our toys at my leisure. ;) You know you are shooting long range when you use a helicopter to re-paint the steel. :D
Image

I can tell I'm among mostly friends here, and its obvious to me that you guys probably do most of your own work. Looking at some of your trucks, I'm envious! I want that! I just want to buy my way into it. ;) Any help you can give in providing direction to a qualified shop that can "pimp my ride" would be greatly appreciated. To the point where if any of you are into precision rifle shooting, long range or otherwise, and can get me with the right shop, I'll throw in a free 2-day PR Fundamentals training class for you and 4 buddies.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by MSCH2112 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:46 pm

your specs are 90mph in a field, 35's, possible supercharger, and you don't have time to do a build? the raptor is what you want. high speed, 35's standard, over 400hp in the ford., and that's standard equipment with no down time.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by jeep_boy02 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:50 pm

Ducky's Dad wrote:
Well...I hate to say it but if your blasting through fields at 90mph (and high speed off road is main offroad use) why not just get a Raptor?

I know, I know, flame suit on.
Yeah, get a Rapturd. Ford engineers protected the front end components by making the frame the weak point.
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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by orkan » Wed Jul 16, 2014 1:28 pm

Oh, one more thing: Since I'm a complete rookie here... how many posts before I get to just have them go live instead of wait for moderator approval? I'm missing a bit of back and forth here, since quite a few posts happen before moderation approves. ;) Thanks again for all the help fellas, I'm looking really hard at Carli right now.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by Pit Slave » Wed Jul 16, 2014 3:12 pm

orkan wrote:Oh, one more thing: Since I'm a complete rookie here... how many posts before I get to just have them go live instead of wait for moderator approval? I'm missing a bit of back and forth here, since quite a few posts happen before moderation approves. ;) Thanks again for all the help fellas, I'm looking really hard at Carli right now.
you're good now with the posts. Got you cleared.

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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by 05PWrockcrawler » Wed Jul 16, 2014 3:23 pm

Call Don Thuren. He will hook you up. Big difference between BDS which is good but Thuren and Carli are a whole other level. Call the guy he will tell you what you need and who you need to go with whether it's his products or someone else's and don't get a Raptor build the ultimate badass Power Wagon you want. The only thing stopping you is your pocket book. Good luck.


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Re: Like to drive them, don't know crap about them. Help me

Post by 04Ram2500Hemi » Wed Jul 16, 2014 3:27 pm

After seeing your post with pictures I'm going to take back AEV. AEV would be for somebody like me who does more slow speed crawling and crappy back roads. With you being in the open like you are I'm going to change my vote to Carli. These guys make a living off of building trucks that are meant to go fast. You may even want to track a guy by the name of George down with 8 Lug- he knows his stuff and can help you build what you're looking for.

Carli: http://www.thecarlisuspension.com/
8 Lug: http://www.8lugtruckgear.com/
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