Thuren Suspension UPDATE for 2014+ PW's

[2wagons1driveway]

I'm thrill to have vendors post here on the forum. But not in this manner. I like it when they post about new products and helping out by answering questions. And not Because then one wins.

this is true. As well.


Sent from Canada

[2wagons1driveway]

I'm done with this drama and will be on here to answer questions more often! I'll have Aaron come on too if that is ok!

ya that Aaron guy is okay.

Tell him to keep the cozies/swag coming with new suspension orders or else Hahaha!!!




Mr. Smith did you ever get a new steering set up? Just do the Thuren fab drag link and TRE or find something else?


Sent from Canada

[Reloaderguy]

Do you know the actual differences in the Power Wagon suspension and a regular 2500 on the 2013+? Is the only difference the springs and shocks?

NOPE!

As I know of....

- Coils front and rear, and shocks, as mentioned.
- Added radius arm bushing for more articulation
- Swaybar
- Rear swaybar links


I'm sure there is more I have not seen, but I hope to pick through a 2016 PW real soon.

Longer track bar too from what I understand.

[black_hawk8888]

I'm with aduleca - I am loving my 2015 PW but the stink bug stance is killing me. The 3rd gen PW stance looks so much better (would have bought one except I needed the true crew cab). I have the 1.5" spacer lift from truxxx.com coming with shock extensions which is a cheap way to fix the problem until Thuren can come out with a definitive set of coils and shocks (they already have the track bar) to level out the PW or at least say that the diesel coils will fit the bill. The 2014+ PW already has a 1" higher rear than a regular 4x4 2500 which is exactly what the Thuren rear coils claim.

From what I've read, the truxxx spacer can't hurt the truck but a suspension level with coils and shocks will maximize the travel. I'm sticking with 35" rubber on stock wheels and just want a leveled truck - I have the lifetime maxcare warranty too so leaving it mostly stock makes sense anyway.

Question for you suspension gurus: will aftermarket springs and shocks void the warranty on any particular items (besides springs and shocks) on the truck? Maxcare warranty covers ball joints and everything so I'm wondering what my risk is by replacing these components...

[ramv]

Agreed with good to see both vendors on this board.

[azracer]

I'm done with this drama and will be on here to answer questions more often! I'll have Aaron come on too if that is ok!

That's awesome, yes I think Aaron would be a welcome addition. He should join the forum too so we know who were conversing with.

I hate this kind of drama and I for one look forward to hearing more about product, future products and technical information than any more of the drama issues.

I sure hope someone addresses the axle shake/wrap issue on the newer trucks. It is so sad to hear about their issues with nothing out there that can address them. One fix they know about now is to just pull the ABS fuse! Now if that wrap issue were solved the world would be a better place or would look that way from their perspective anyway. Don have you got any ideas in the works for this? I suspect solid spherical links and upgraded shocks would help. I have a 2009 3G and your 2.5" stage 2+ kings nearly eliminated the axle wrap and after I added your LT leaves it stopped it entirely. I put on your short body 12" bypasses and some of it came back. So for Me on the leaf sprung truck a good shock helped a ton (bypasses not so much).

[2wagons1driveway]

I'm with aduleca - I am loving my 2015 PW but the stink bug stance is killing me. The 3rd gen PW stance looks so much better (would have bought one except I needed the true crew cab). I have the 1.5" spacer lift from truxxx.com coming with shock extensions which is a cheap way to fix the problem until Thuren can come out with a definitive set of coils and shocks (they already have the track bar) to level out the PW or at least say that the diesel coils will fit the bill. The 2014+ PW already has a 1" higher rear than a regular 4x4 2500 which is exactly what the Thuren rear coils claim.

From what I've read, the truxxx spacer can't hurt the truck but a suspension level with coils and shocks will maximize the travel. I'm sticking with 35" rubber on stock wheels and just want a leveled truck - I have the lifetime maxcare warranty too so leaving it mostly stock makes sense anyway.

Question for you suspension gurus: will aftermarket springs and shocks void the warranty on any particular items (besides springs and shocks) on the truck? Maxcare warranty covers ball joints and everything so I'm wondering what my risk is by replacing these components...

the dealer or aft market warranty company will grab at anything to not pay a bill. My advice with a warranty like that don't modify the truck- no rims no tires no suspension of any kind and you WONT have issues change any of that shit and you may have issues you may not.

Everyone's trying to save a buck and they would rather keep it then give it to you lol


Sent from Canada

[adeluca73]

Guess I inadvertently stirred the hornets nest, & my thread got hijacked worse than the Achille Lauro cruise ship ... this is the first forum I've ever joined so I had no idea of the all that crap that's been going on between vendors.

I just want to hear about how to improve my truck, keeping it a PW is important to me & I DONT want to turn it into a 2500CTD w/ a factory winch, & I know other owners feel the same, so I posted Mr. Theuren's email response to me as a public service to the forum & to hopefully keep the repetitive emails to Thuren to a minimum. I didn't realize this was going to happen. I just want to get tech information about what's best for the PW, heavier springs, longer lighter springs w/ boogies, new shocks etc, regardless of the manufacturer.

Good intentions are victim to the devil of reality I guess...

[djgaston]

Just finished emails and heading out, just following up. Don, no I didn't mean it to sound like you were calling me a liar, thief, etc. I should have been more clear. The mods on CF are the ones doing that, not you. Sorry for the general statement. I get what you are saying, again the problems have been fixed and we're working on beefing up the staff even more. I'm at 5 people now, like to be at 8 right now and probably 10 by summer. The BBB hasn't had anything to do with anything other than a few people complaining on there, and one on Yelp. Doesn't affect anything I do. Sometimes people need to wait more than a day to get a refund. The last guy to complain on CF ordered a Borgeson box that has been on back order and listed as such on my site for months. He got tired of waiting and asked for a refund. I didn't get to his email until the following day and he had already posted on CF about it. I issued the credit and then found out about the post from someone else. I don't go on there at all so complaining on there is nothing more than having an audience for your complaint, I don't see them at all. He used the refund to buy a steering kit and that shipped a few days later, and is on his truck. Doubt he followed up the complaint with that info though. You are very right, people are so impatient now. When I started, 4-6 weeks was the minimum on anything. It was okay back then, but it's not anymore. I am waiting six weeks on fiberglass, eight weeks on beadlocks, and three weeks on a big shock order, right now. But I order stuff all the time and am used to it. Some people aren't and that's why I put so much money into a warehouse and inventory. Never had that before. We went from 2,000 square feet to just under 8,000 with lots of room to expand. Anyway, sorry for the general comments. Not all were directed towards you, but the issues in general. The shipping comment had a winky face so I hoped you would take it as me joking with you, don't get bent out of shape over it. I'm over the whole thing and was trying to lighten it up a little.

Mr Smith, you were one of the people I was talking about when I said I made people mad on here. Sorry for how it was handled. I remember our dealings very well and I can only promise you that the refund was issued the first time, I had assumed it went through because it showed approved when I processed it. I didn't know that it didn't go through until you emailed me a week later or however long it was. I know it sounds like BS but I promise that it was run. I run all cards on a virtual terminal that is web-based and something didn't click all the way through with that. If you are still mad three years later, that sucks, but it's your right. I'm glad you got the truck fixed and have something you are happy with.

Thanks everyone else for the kind words and for not letting the issues between Don and I be a problem. I think we have them worked out. I've been on here for several years and it's hard to draw the line between just being a PW owner and owning DOR sometimes. I like to discuss things as a consumer like anyone else, but I always have the DOR hat on so that makes it complicated. But hey, if I did one good thing for this site, I got Don to sign up finally so you're all welcome for that. lol. Have a good weekend everyone. Sorry again for the derailment.

[MoparToYou]

I've been on various offroad forums since the 1990's (Jeep, motorcycle, UTV, etc,). You used to never see manufacturers on a forum, but now you do. I think it is important to have the manufacturers here to answer questions about their products, and prevent people from attacking them, which is often from a simple misunderstanding. It used to be pretty common to see someone come on a forum saying "Teraflex (insert manufacturer of choice) is so terrible, blah, blah, blah", and then the thread would go on for days, with fan boys of other manufacturers chiming in. Now, if someone starts an attack, the manufacturers representative on the forum will respond, and ask what the problem is, and how it can be remedied. That is a much more professional way to do business, rather than hiding from sight, with no presence on the discussion forums. So it is good to see all of the manufacturers here.

And while you're here, how about a request ot two.

The 2014+ Ram 2500s have more axle wrap / hop than pretty much any other 4x4s do. How about doing something about it, so these trucks are worth keeping?

Sell us a single rear kicker shock that has three or four times the damping as the stock shock, and is equally damped in both directions, like a steering stabilizer. I converted my trucks single kicker shock to a triple kicker shock design, and it helps decrease rear axle wrap / hop by leaps and bounds, but having a single shock that does the same thing would be much simpler. Or better yet, build a ~1 1/2" spacer that goes under the axle mount for the kicker shock, to increase leverage on the shock, and increase damping that way.

Build us a set of rear control arms with good solid johnny joints instead of the big soft rubber bushings that allow the axle wrap / hop to occur. Make the arms adjustable, and able to be used both on stock trucks and on lifted trucks. And make them stout enough to be used for towing and hauling, which we still do with our Power Wagons.

Build us a set of high clearance front radius arms that have bushings with a higher durometer material, and articu-links with a higher durometer material, to help prevent front axle wrap / hop, which is just as bad as rear axle wrap / hop on these trucks. Have the front radius arms incorporate a skid plate on the front to protect them from damage, because the stock radius arms hang way down there, and function as a rock magnet the way they are now. Make the radius arms usable on both stock and lifted trucks, or sell two versions, for stock and lifted.

When you build a lift for these trucks, keep in mind those of us that haul or tow with our trucks. I looked at the trip meter on my digital dash computer that shows how many miles I have had a trailer hooked up to my truck, and since purchase of the truck, fully 1/3 of the miles on my truck have been with a trailer on the back. I don't want a lift that lifts the front of the truck a lot more than the rear of the truck, because those lifts make our trucks look like a girl dog squatting to pee when we hook a trailer to it. Build a lift with two different rear lift options if you must.

Thanks again for being on the forum. Now returning this thread to its previously scheduled format ...

[Bill2014]

...

When you build a lift for these trucks, keep in mind those of us that haul or tow with our trucks. I looked at the trip meter on my digital dash computer that shows how many miles I have had a trailer hooked up to my truck, and since purchase of the truck, fully 1/3 of the miles on my truck have been with a trailer on the back. I don't want a lift that lifts the front of the truck a lot more than the rear of the truck, because those lifts make our trucks look like a girl dog squatting to pee when we hook a trailer to it. Build a lift with two different rear lift options if you must.

...

Adding a lift isn't a typical direction that people go when their focus is towing. Lifts may be necessary to support larger tires but the larger tires generally support lower pressures which can impact handling. And larger diameter tires raise your gearing which is also not ideal for towing.

[MoparToYou]

That sounds like it came from Captain Obvious. I think we already knew all of that. I'm not talking about a 4" or 6" lift, 40" tires, and trying to tow like we have a diesel. I was talking about the difference between the 1/2" rear lift I saw mentioned earlier in this thread, and a more reasonable 1 1/2" rear lift. And, we're towing with a Power Wagon here, so its not going to be a heavy load, we just don't want the rear end looking like it is squatting before we even hook up the trailer.

[Colibri]

Active vendors, well educated consumers, and options are all a good thing. I'm happy to have any company who practices ethical business on this forum. The pot got stirred, now back to enjoying and learning more about our trucks and their suspensions!

[Bill2014]

That sounds like it came from Captain Obvious. I think we already knew all of that. I'm not talking about a 4" or 6" lift, 40" tires, and trying to tow like we have a diesel. I was talking about the difference between the 1/2" rear lift I saw mentioned earlier in this thread, and a more reasonable 1 1/2" rear lift. And, we're towing with a Power Wagon here, so its not going to be a heavy load, we just don't want the rear end looking like it is squatting before we even hook up the trailer.

The point is that lifts are only required to support larger tires (and perhaps help with approach and depart angles) they don't help make a better tow vehicle.

I happen to tow heavy quite often - but I understand that that most Powerwagon owners don't. (15,000 lbs in tow)

Not sure there is enough of a market for the vendors to invest in anything related to power wagons and towing. There are already some inexpensive solutions out there to address that issue (like JBM did).

[thuren]

I'm with aduleca - I am loving my 2015 PW but the stink bug stance is killing me. The 3rd gen PW stance looks so much better (would have bought one except I needed the true crew cab). I have the 1.5" spacer lift from truxxx.com coming with shock extensions which is a cheap way to fix the problem until Thuren can come out with a definitive set of coils and shocks (they already have the track bar) to level out the PW or at least say that the diesel coils will fit the bill. The 2014+ PW already has a 1" higher rear than a regular 4x4 2500 which is exactly what the Thuren rear coils claim.

From what I've read, the truxxx spacer can't hurt the truck but a suspension level with coils and shocks will maximize the travel. I'm sticking with 35" rubber on stock wheels and just want a leveled truck - I have the lifetime maxcare warranty too so leaving it mostly stock makes sense anyway.

Question for you suspension gurus: will aftermarket springs and shocks void the warranty on any particular items (besides springs and shocks) on the truck? Maxcare warranty covers ball joints and everything so I'm wondering what my risk is by replacing these components...

I am very familiar with the 2005-2012 PW generation, and when I saw my first 2014 PW I thought it sat MORE level, than the previous Gen.

As long as you keep the lift within reason, warranty should be no issue.

[2wagons1driveway]

All depends on how much the dealer likes you ^^^ :p


Sent from Canada

[thuren]

From what I've read, the truxxx spacer can't hurt the truck but a suspension level with coils and shocks will maximize the travel. I'm sticking with 35" rubber on stock wheels and just want a leveled truck - I have the lifetime maxcare warranty too so leaving it mostly stock makes sense anyway.

Thing is, I don't suggest ANY coils spacers on the front with this platform. I never had a problem with spacers on the 1996-2013 platform as the coil spring design is very generic, uses large springs that are very stout, and well supported. On the 2013+ platform, in my opinion, Ram really dropped the ball with the coil spring design(among other things). The angled seats and flat top/bottom coils they use, REALLY stresses the coil, even just static at ride height. It took a lot of tweaking to get my coils to sit (mostly)straight in the mounts. Look at any trucks coil bow with stock coils and coil spacers. It's horrendous usually. Then on top of that, these smaller coils are over-stressed when you add spacers, as they have to compress farther to have the truck bottom out. So, any proper level for these new trucks must also drop the bumpstops the same amount, to try and keep the coils happy.

Sure you could get to work and rally parking lots with spacers, but seeing a PW with spacers, is a shame.

[thuren]

All depends on how much the dealer likes you ^^^ :p


Sent from Canada

Good point.... I just picked up my CTD fromt the dealer last night with the new 4:10 gears SO much better! The 3:42 and 38's were, ummm, lame...... I used factory Hemi option 4:10 gears so I kept my powertrain warranty!

[Reloaderguy]

Are you saying this isn't perfect?

[Reloaderguy]

The part number for a regular 2500 front track bar is: 68223802AA
The part number for a Power Wagon front track bar is: 68193870AC

I don't know what the difference is but they are listed with separate numbers. My understanding is the PW track bar is longer.

[black_hawk8888]

Thing is, I don't suggest ANY coils spacers on the front with this platform. I never had a problem with spacers on the 1996-2013 platform as the coil spring design is very generic, uses large springs that are very stout, and well supported. On the 2013+ platform, in my opinion, Ram really dropped the ball with the coil spring design(among other things). The angled seats and flat top/bottom coils they use, REALLY stresses the coil, even just static at ride height. It took a lot of tweaking to get my coils to sit (mostly)straight in the mounts. Look at any trucks coil bow with stock coils and coil spacers. It's horrendous usually. Then on top of that, these smaller coils are over-stressed when you add spacers, as they have to compress farther to have the truck bottom out. So, any proper level for these new trucks must also drop the bumpstops the same amount, to try and keep the coils happy.

Sure you could get to work and rally parking lots with spacers, but seeing a PW with spacers, is a shame.

Good to know and thanks. That means you need to hurry up and approve your coils for the PW or design some new ones so us 5th gen guys can level our trucks out!

[FirerescuePW]

Don- thanks for joining the site. I hope this is the beginning of a beneficial relationship for all of us. Hook Aaron up.

Danny- thanks for your efforts to persevere. It sounds like you are in a good spot.

Everyone- I think we all won this one. Let's use it to our advantage. Constructive from here forward. Let other forums host b.s., and we can get back to the way we started- honest, mature discussions and a buttload of knowledge.

[cruz]

Don- thanks for joining the site. I hope this is the beginning of a beneficial relationship for all of us. Hook Aaron up.

Danny- thanks for your efforts to persevere. It sounds like you are in a good spot.

Everyone- I think we all won this one. Let's use it to our advantage. Constructive from here forward. Let other forums host b.s., and we can get back to the way we started- honest, mature discussions and a buttload of knowledge.

X2 !
Now everyone, all together with your best singing voices... KUMBAYA, KUMBAYA

[RustyPW]

Don- thanks for joining the site. I hope this is the beginning of a beneficial relationship for all of us. Hook Aaron up.

Danny- thanks for your efforts to persevere. It sounds like you are in a good spot.

Everyone- I think we all won this one. Let's use it to our advantage. Constructive from here forward. Let other forums host b.s., and we can get back to the way we started- honest, mature discussions and a buttload of knowledge.

X2 !
Now everyone, all together with your best singing voices... KUMBAYA, KUMBAYA

I was thinking the same thing when I read Mike's post.

[2wagons1driveway]

All depends on how much the dealer likes you ^^^ :p


Sent from Canada

Good point.... I just picked up my CTD fromt the dealer last night with the new 4:10 gears SO much better! The 3:42 and 38's were, ummm, lame...... I used factory Hemi option 4:10 gears so I kept my powertrain warranty!

pretty jealous of all these new wagons with sweet gear options available for them and the stout 11.5.... Should make many more tire options feasible for hemi owners again. Not haveing to put a diesel rear end in just to run taller then a 4.56 is friggin sweet haha

Sent from Canada