2017

Easttnrhino · Post by **Easttnrhino** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 5:36 am

Saw pictures of 2017 power wagon and liked it anyone seen the real thing or know when they will be out?

MSCH2112 · Post by **MSCH2112** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:56 pm

i believe you can order 17's now and i think some dealers already have new 17's in stock. you won't find it on the ram.com page cause they are trying to get rid of exist. 16' inventory.

mike

vanished · Post by **vanished** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:05 pm

I may be wrong (it happens!) but I thought the '17 PW was a delayed launch, like November timing....

YouTube · Post by **OffroadTreks** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:27 pm

It's a delayed launch from the last news source I heard.

Low_Sky · Post by **Low_Sky** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:45 pm

There's a guy on Ram Forum claiming to have ordered a 2017 Laramie PW 3 weeks ago.

cruz · Post by **cruz** » Thu Sep 15, 2016 7:47 pm

Nobody asked, but here's my $00.02 anyway ...

Phantom · Post by **Phantom** » Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:28 am

Sexy

TwinStick · Post by **TwinStick** » Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:17 am

Yeah, my dealer is playing the "we can't order them yet game" as well. They have a blue 2016 they keep trying to sell me. I told them to call me back when the G-56 is on the option list or an auto with those same gear ratio's.

Boomerttl · Post by **Boomerttl** » Fri Sep 16, 2016 7:48 pm

The orange looks pretty sweet, but I sure would like to see one in white.

Easttnrhino · Post by **Easttnrhino** » Sat Sep 17, 2016 6:33 am

Went to local dealer he said this past Monday was first day you could have ordered. The tradesman power wagon still available, but does not have rebel grill. Leather package available in power wagon, did not think to ask about larame. His rep says none of them will be delivered till December and or January.

olyelr · Post by **olyelr** » Sat Sep 17, 2016 8:17 am

The laramie is available. Looks basically like the '16s except it has that grill.

olyelr · Post by **olyelr** » Sat Sep 17, 2016 8:27 am

Only one i could find.

Will · Post by **Will** » Sat Sep 17, 2016 4:59 pm

That grill is ugly to me.

olyelr · Post by **olyelr** » Sat Sep 17, 2016 5:44 pm

Will wrote:That grill is ugly to me.

Yeah, i dont like it in that laramie at all. I think it looks pretty good with the slt one with the badging though. The ram on the gate is wearing on me too.

TwinStick · Post by **TwinStick** » Sun Sep 18, 2016 1:47 am

Red one in above pic looks nice.

Easttnrhino · Post by **Easttnrhino** » Sun Sep 18, 2016 6:28 am

I am new to this but in twinsstick endings he does this crawl ratio thing old vs new thing with the ratios. I thought crawl ratio was low gear times low range times axle ratio. And what is low range ratio in power wagon. Thanks

TwinStick · Post by **TwinStick** » Sun Sep 18, 2016 8:35 pm

It is: transmission gear ratio x axle ratio x Lo range ratio. What don't you get ? My truck: 2008 Dodge Power Wagon w/G-56 manual shift. It's 1st gear ratio is 6.29. Axle ratio is 4.56. Lo range ratio is 2.72. Mine has a crawl ratio of 78.01613:1

New trucks are Auto trans only. My findings are: 1st gear is 3.0. Axle ratio is 4.10. Lo range is 2.64. So, 3.0:1 x 4.10:1 x 2.64:1 = 32.47:1 Crawl ratio.

My trucks crawl ratio is more than 2x lower than the new ones. It is even lower than a Jeep Rubicon w/manual trans, 410's in the axles & 4.0:1 Lo range t-case, which is like 64:1.

Low/er gears are NOT for everyone. (But this IS a PW---supposed to be THE off road truck) Mpg's SUCK. Engine turns much faster at the same speed limit. But when you add 35's or even 37's to my manual equipped truck, i'm not crying that it has no power. I plan to lift it someday, maybe. What i do do with my truck mostly is tow. My last camper was 10,500 lbs. %.7L, 345hp Hemi towed it just fine BECAUSE of the low gears in the G-56 manual 6-speed trans. We had an 04' Dodge Ram QC 2500 4x4 w/same hp Hemi, 545RFE trans, 4.10's in the axles & it ABSOLUTELY SUCKED for towing the same camper our PW did with no problems at all. 04' was either screaming in 2nd or lugging in 3rd & constantly shifting between the 2. The 545RFE is called a 5 speed, but in all reality, for HD work, it is a 3 speed because it never even got into 4th or 5th when towing 10,500 lbs, even on flat ground, into the wind, it kept shifting back & forth just to maintain 55 mph, in 2nd & 3rd. And

does anyone really need 2 or 3 overdrives for in a HD work truck. We need the ability to do HD stuff, with a HD truck, with a gas engine.

They are trying to get better MPG's with them for 2 reasons: 1) to comply with the strict Gov't regs on CAFE or (Combined Average Fuel/Fleet Economy & 2) yeah, people are complaining.

Hope this helps you understand what us Older PW owners are talking about. Many of us (well, me anyways) see it as just another example of a good thing, being watered down, slowly, a little at a time, until POOF, no more PWagons. They will probably say some bullshit like "lack of sales" or "did not meet sales expectations" or some other bullshit like that.

I have seen many times where a maker FINALLY gets something right & them POOF, the next year it is gone. Some examples: Solid front axle GM trucks. 454's in them. Chevy Caprice w/LT1's. AMGeneral with the HI Hummer/D-Max/Allison. Todays 3/4 & 1 ton trucks are sporting the same sized u-joints of some 1/2 tons of years gone by. Hell, we used to pull a 6000+ lb camper with a station wagon when I was a kid. Now you need a 1/2 or 3/4 ton truck to do that. Maybe I am just getting old, but @ 53, I don't feel that old.

So, in closing, when using a gas engine in a HD truck, you need transmissions that are geared lower & closer together. Gas engines (most) simply do not have the abundance of torque (950 lb ft in the new Cummins 6.7) like the diesels do. They have so much, they can make up for the lack of proper gear ratios in the transmissions. On the other side of that coin, diesels are too heavy for an off-road truck like the PW. It would & does sink off road, not to mention that 950 lb ft of torque would destroy the u-joints when the lockers are engaged. We are now up to 10 speed auto's in the new Ford F-150's, so IMHO, there is absolutely no excuse why they can't make a true HD auto trans for gas trucks. I just saw the new F-150's loaded up KR Platinum is now $64,449 !!! A loaded up F-450 KR Dually is like $94,000 !!!

Easttnrhino · Post by **Easttnrhino** » Sun Sep 18, 2016 8:46 pm

Wow dude you have issues. I am sorry if I stepped on your toes. And trust me I checked trans ratio before I posted and I under stand torque converters. But some people just think there is only one way to do things (usally there's ) once again I am sorry if I offended you.

TwinStick · Post by **TwinStick** » Sun Sep 18, 2016 8:48 pm

You did NOT step on my toes at all. I was just trying to let you see where I was comming from. No worries at all.

& yeah,

I got issues. Don't we all LOL

Low_Sky · Post by **Low_Sky** » Mon Sep 19, 2016 1:53 pm

Easttnrhino wrote:Wow dude you have issues. I am sorry if I stepped on your toes. And trust me I checked trans ratio before I posted and I under stand torque converters. But some people just think there is only one way to do things (usally there's ) once again I am sorry if I offended you.

TwinStick just gave a VERY thorough answer to your question, Easttnrhino. This forum is normally a Butthurt Free Zone and we all get along just fine. If he sounded pissy, it's because he's upset about the pussification of HD gas truck auto trannies.

ramv · Post by **ramv** » Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:41 pm

TwinStick wrote:. I just saw the new F-150's loaded up KR Platinum is now $64,449 !!! A loaded up F-450 KR Dually is like $94,000 !!!

I just built on Ford's website the most loaded F450 (Platinum Ultimate with twin sunroofs, all the cameras, etc) and its $82k,$81k for the same in KR not sure how you can get to $94k MSRP let alone out the door.

I do agree a G56 would be nice in these current trucks. With the stupid low first gear and auto trans I doubt I would ever need lower gear for crawling, but for towing and daily driver, some better gears would be nice. I really miss the manual for daily driving and towing. Autos are lame. Off-road is a different story. My 2nd gen Rock Crawler has 4:1 Rubicon T-case, 2.45:1 46RE, 5.13s and 42"s (~40:1)and is plenty low for crawling with an anemic 5.9 Magnum.

Reloaderguy · Post by **Reloaderguy** » Mon Sep 19, 2016 10:56 pm

TwinStick wrote:
Hope this helps you understand what us Older PW owners are talking about. Many of us (well, me anyways) see it as just another example of a good thing, being watered down, slowly, a little at a time, until POOF, no more PWagons. They will probably say some bullshit like "lack of sales" or "did not meet sales expectations" or some other bullshit like that.

Just because the 545 and 66 RFE suck doesn't mean the G56 doesn't suck. The G56 is effectively a 4 speed with a widely spaced overdrive and only shines when coupled with improperly matched final drive ratios and oversized tires. I don't get the nostalgia, the older trucks have weak steering, small ball joints, smaller R&P (with limited ratios), smaller diffs, suspension filled with small rubber joints, track bars prone to failure, etc. You got a manual transmission though.

Frankly I wouldn't even think twice if FCA folded the Power Wagon features into all of the Ram trucks and then dropped the name. Who gives a shit, it's a truck at the end of the day and I bought it for it's features, not because I can lord the badges on the door over my neighbor.

TwinStick · Post by **TwinStick** » Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:10 pm

Low_Sky wrote:
Easttnrhino wrote:Wow dude you have issues. I am sorry if I stepped on your toes. And trust me I checked trans ratio before I posted and I under stand torque converters. But some people just think there is only one way to do things (usally there's ) once again I am sorry if I offended you.
TwinStick just gave a VERY thorough answer to your question, Easttnrhino. This forum is normally a Butthurt Free Zone and we all get along just fine. If he sounded pissy, it's because he's upset about the pussification of HD gas truck auto trannies.

Yup, you hit the nail square on the head !!!

It just aggravates the shit outta me that anyone has to spend the stupid big bucks they charge for new vehicles & then throw another 10-30k at it to get it where it should be (if it is going to be touted as "the most capable off-road factory truck ever" ). The reason most know NOTHING about PW's is because someone is NOT doing their job in marketing.

How hard would it be to have a lifted factory Chevy, GMC, Ford, Toyota Tundra & Nissan Titan XD----all with their "off-road" packages, on a set of rollers under all 3 tires, to demonstrate why a PW, with true front & rear lockers, will get you out & home when all the others will not ? The only other factory truck that might be able to drive off the rollers is a Raptor, because it at least has a limited slip front diff. Yamaha did that same commercial with their Yamaha Grizzly, when it was the first to have both a locking front & rear axle. Thats why it became the most popular one....until all the others copied their move. See, more sales benefits us all. If sales jump, then who would ever want to eliminate them ? Money talks.

As far as those prices, they came off one of the weekend TV shows about trucks. They put a tuner in a 2017 F-150 KR Ultra Platinum or something & they said it was stickered at $64,449. Then the other guys says "wow, wonder what a 2017 F-450 KR loaded up goes for & the other guy said " I think like $94k. Thats where those numbers came from, not the web site.

Edit, I just went to the ford truck website & did an F-450 build..............$87,780 loaded up, then add in NYState sales tax @ 8%, = $7,022.40. Your grand total is............$94,802.40. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWPbFZywfbs

ramv · Post by **ramv** » Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:33 pm

So I guess that makes the number wrong. Like all TV shows. Sunday morning shows are the worst place for data ever.

I am buying two new F-350 XLT diesel dually 4x4s w/ gooseneck tomorrow for $100k, $94k for one F450 KR doesn't make sense at all.

It would be nice if the PW options were standalone on the Ram line, or a manual trans was an option, but whatever, mine is fine for point a to point b, will tow my trailer with my second gen (10k lb) ok and wheels decent for it's ridiculous size.

TwinStick · Post by **TwinStick** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 12:05 am

Reloaderguy wrote:
TwinStick wrote:
Hope this helps you understand what us Older PW owners are talking about. Many of us (well, me anyways) see it as just another example of a good thing, being watered down, slowly, a little at a time, until POOF, no more PWagons. They will probably say some bullshit like "lack of sales" or "did not meet sales expectations" or some other bullshit like that.

Just because the 545 and 66 RFE suck doesn't mean the G56 doesn't suck. The G56 is effectively a 4 speed with a widely spaced overdrive and only shines when coupled with improperly matched final drive ratios and oversized tires. I don't get the nostalgia, the older trucks have weak steering, small ball joints, smaller R&P (with limited ratios), smaller diffs, suspension filled with small rubber joints, track bars prone to failure, etc. You got a manual transmission though.

Frankly I wouldn't even think twice if FCA folded the Power Wagon features into all of the Ram trucks and then dropped the name. Who gives a shit, it's a truck at the end of the day and I bought it for it's features, not because I can lord the badges on the door over my neighbor.

We will agree to disagree then. The G-56 is a properly spaced 6-speed manual transmission for HD work. How you figure it is a 4 speed is beyond me. I use all 6 gears. 1st when towing, (gives me a REAL advantage starting out on a hill) even with our new 3500 lb camper. I can use 6th if the wind is at my back & on flat ground. I towed a 10,500 lb camper with mine, for 10 years. Before the Wagon, a 2004 Dodge Ram 2500 QC w.Hemi/auto /4.10's. It absolutely SUCKED for towing our 10,500 lb camper. It NEVER went past 2nd & 3rd gear, just to maintain 55 mph on flat ground. It was a 5 speed (essentially a 3 speed w/2 overdrives). 5th gear in the G-56 is 1.0:1. That is where it spends most of it's time with the new camper. The older, heavier one, i still used 5th gear but shifted down to 4th a lot more than I do now. Overdrive is 0.79 in the G-56. It is 0.63 in the 545RFE auto. I can cruise @ 70 easily while towing our new camper. The 4.56's work GREAT for me. If i lift the truck, & go to 37's, I would love to be able to go to 5.13's but 4.88's are my only option bone stock. Could do 5.13's if I swapped in an 11.5" AAM from a diesel. I suppose if I wanted to use my truck as a car, then 4.10's, or 3.73's would be fine. I use my truck as a truck & the stock 33's & 4.56's make my truck a towing machine. I can downshift when i want to & crank up the rpms for more power when climbing grades like Eisenhower pass, or keep the rpms lower & go slower because i have more gears to drop down into. We don't have a lot of money & our PW is our jack-of-all-trades vehicle. I would not change a thing. But the arrogance of the manufactures telling us "we know what you want, better than you know what you want", is just a sign that they are so out of touch with what their customers want, that it's just not even funny anymore. At least to me anyways. YRMV. Yeah, if they made lockers & a winch avail on all/any HD 2500/3500, I could see them folding up the PW & putting it in the gone forever/remember when drawer. Why would anyone "lord the badges" ? Freedom of choice is part of what makes this country great. I have been inside of Communist East Berlin in the early 80's before the wall came down. Through Check Point Alpha, Bravo & Charlie. I have seen firsthand what it is like to have no choice at all. So, when people in this country keep taking our choices away for us, it may bother me more than most. I am quite capable at making up my own mind,

Yeah, i know the new trucks have improved in some areas. But no matter what you do to a truck, if it is not geared properly for HD work, when it says HD on it, what good is it really. They should have left the 4.56's as standard ratios for PW's IMHO. I ordered ours like I did because it was geared so low, compared to the auto i traded in on it. Mine was $48k. $38k after my trade. What are the new ones going for ?

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