AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

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Oilbrnr
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AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Oilbrnr » Wed Jul 10, 2019 3:35 pm

Just wondering those that have one, have you observed the functionality of it, i.e. the impeller spinning at idle and very rapidly at higher RPMs?
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Colibri » Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:52 pm

I believe it’s a rebranded Donaldson top spin prefilter. If that’s the case, it’s actually completely legit. Those things centrifugally eject dust very well and cut wat down on filter maintenance. I have a Donaldson on a big cat 7.2 and that thing doubled my filter life
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Oilbrnr » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:04 pm

It is a Sy-Klone model 9005. According to the tech I spoke with at Sy-Klone, that is the size they recommend for a D6 dozer. AEV support was shit, supposedly their engineering dept. says that is the correct size for both the 6.4 and Cummins. BULLSHIT. I'm pissed, and wanted to confirm with others that they are still shipping the 9005 as part of their kit.

At a bit of a loss as to what to do. I'd like to start a social media campaign against AEV.
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by RPS1030 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:28 pm

Oilbrnr wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:04 pm
It is a Sy-Klone model 9005. According to the tech I spoke with at Sy-Klone, that is the size they recommend for a D6 dozer. AEV support was shit, supposedly their engineering dept. says that is the correct size for both the 6.4 and Cummins. BULLSHIT. I'm pissed, and wanted to confirm with others that they are still shipping the 9005 as part of their kit.

At a bit of a loss as to what to do. I'd like to start a social media campaign against AEV.
300-500 CFM

6.4L at 5000 RPM
6.7L at 4000 RPM
9.3L at 2000 RPM

All in the same ballpark of airflow.

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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Jack187 » Sat Aug 03, 2019 3:32 pm

Oilbrnr wrote:
Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:04 pm
It is a Sy-Klone model 9005. According to the tech I spoke with at Sy-Klone, that is the size they recommend for a D6 dozer. AEV support was shit, supposedly their engineering dept. says that is the correct size for both the 6.4 and Cummins. BULLSHIT. I'm pissed, and wanted to confirm with others that they are still shipping the 9005 as part of their kit.

At a bit of a loss as to what to do. I'd like to start a social media campaign against AEV.
I just ordered an AEV snorkel with the air ram. I am going to pick up a pre-filter separately.
Are you wanting the 9005 or trying to avoid it?
Sorry if I'm misreading your post.
It just seemed like you might have some information that might be useful as I look into a pre-filter.
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Oilbrnr » Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:47 pm

9005 is too big for both the Cummins and of course the 6.4
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Jack187 » Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:03 am

Oilbrnr wrote:
Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:47 pm
9005 is too big for both the Cummins and of course the 6.4
It looks like it is the correct one if you use a CFM calculator. https://www.widman.biz/English/Calculators/CFM.html

Using 5600 rpm as max rpm (The 2016 PW is rated at 410hp at 5600), and 0.8 efficiency (which is typical for a naturally aspirated engine), it comes to 506 cfm. It looks pretty much spot on.
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Oilbrnr » Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:02 pm

When I talked to Sy-Klone, the guy laughed and said that the 9005 is what they use on a D6 Cat. He said that the 9001R is the correct unit for our application which is a 4" outlet vs 5". The adapter tube is item 901K2.

Are you going to be running your engine at 5600 RPM all the time for it to work? My advise, send it back if you haven't installed already, and request the scoop. Waste of money unless used as designed, for industrial applications.
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Jack187 » Sat Aug 10, 2019 11:25 am

Based on the physics involved, I'd still go with the 9005 based on it's listed, and I assume tested, stats.

The Sy-Clone website specifically says "Always select model based on engine airflow requirement, then use adaptation for any difference in diameter."

The 9001R would result in an effective RPM cap at 4000 rpm or below on a 6.4L engine. This is using a really benign volumetric efficiency (VE) rating of 0.8 , which is typically used for any generic naturally aspirated non-high performance gas engine. The engine could still go over 4000 RPM, but power would be severely impacted.

Although I can't find a specific rating anywhere, I suspect the 5.7 and 6.4 hemis are going to be closer to 1.0 VE with even a simple change like improved exhaust and an intake filter replacement like the K&N. My old 78 ford F-150 had a VE around 0.8 .

Using a volumetric efficiency of 1.0 , The 9001R results in an effective rpm cap of 2650 RPM on a 6.4L hemi. Revving any higher will result in a substantial loss of potential power due to intake flow constriction and a rapid decrease in volumetric efficiency.

Considering a 0.8 VE on the 6.4L hemi would hit a CFM cap at roughly 5600 RPM using the 9005, which is the rated peak HP for the engine,
this would be almost ideal, except I am pretty sure the VE is actually closer to 1.0 .

Using a VE of 1.0 , it would hit the cap at 4500.

So, basically, by using the the 9001R instead of the 9005, you are giving up substantial power for 1/3 of your RPM band in a best case scenario or over 1/2 the rpm band in a worst case scenario.

I don't see any reasonable way to justify that type of power restriction just to keep out a little bit more dirt, unless you weren't running a filter at all. I can still see using a potentially over-sized pre-filter over an air ram though if the added filtration outweighs the small amount of HP gained from the air ram.

I agree the pre-filter spinner is not going to be spinning at optimal speed all the time, but it will be spinning enough to give some benefit for smaller debris, and has a screen to eliminate larger leaf size/type debris. The direction of the intake also reduces intake of rain and snow, which are my larger concern in late fall / winter up north.
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Oilbrnr » Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:59 am

Well, from personal experience, it ain't going to do anything at normal operating RPM while in dusty conditions, and I drive in that situation every day. But hey if it makes you feel better to have it on, knock your socks off. Post back up when you have it installed and running your engine at 1500-2k and let us know how that vane is spinning.

As to snow/rain with the ram intake, rotate 180*. It's ~$40 from AEV.
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Jack187 » Sun Aug 11, 2019 2:53 pm

You might check out the Donaldson Top Spin instead of the Sy-Klone.

It appears to cover a greater CFM range for the 5" model.
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Jack187 » Sun Aug 11, 2019 7:08 pm

Found a new one that might interest you:

http://www.enginaire.com/composite-precleaners/
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Re: AEV Dorkel Pre-Filter, who has one? Functioning?

Post by Jack187 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 3:04 pm

Oilbrnr wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:59 am
Well, from personal experience, it ain't going to do anything at normal operating RPM while in dusty conditions, and I drive in that situation every day. But hey if it makes you feel better to have it on, knock your socks off. Post back up when you have it installed and running your engine at 1500-2k and let us know how that vane is spinning.

As to snow/rain with the ram intake, rotate 180*. It's ~$40 from AEV.
I see what you are saying. You do make a good point. I am eyeballing the 4" one from Engineair now.
I'd like to have a functioning filter, but also want to try to keep the airflow up to reduce any reduction in power. It looks like it would be effective starting at about 1500 rpm and only see <10% CFM reduction on the last 1000 rpm of the top end.
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