Making new tire & wheel plunge

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PWPunchinAZ
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Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by PWPunchinAZ » Fri Nov 29, 2019 7:31 pm

Greetings, I’m here humbly seeking guidance. I have a 2017 Power Wagon with stock wheels & tires. I’m getting ready to take the plunge for a new set of both. I Have a couple questions for those with more experience than I have, please. For lifestyle usage: I’m in Az, 6800 elev (snow& ice), work on a cattle Ranch with lots of dirt & rock. I see a lot of off road. I’ve had 4 flats in last two months. 2 were not repairable. I definitely need to up my load range. But not sure if I should go E or F?

The tire I’m looking at getting is Toyo Rt 35x12.5R18 (Load E). I have to fill some of that wheel well space. The 285’s I have now just look “wrong”. Lol. But don’t want to rub or lift. So 35’s are biggest I can go then, right? I also just heard there is an F load range for The Toyo’s. Would that be a better way to go?

The wheel I’m looking at is Fuel off road Blitz D674. (Bronze color). My budget says I can go up to 18’s. . But today I learned the stock wheel has “bead protection”. Is that right? And how important is it to have? I’m not sure if the Fuel wheels does or not? So now I’m not sure if it’s smarter to keep them stock?

Any thoughts or advice from experience will be welcomed & appreciated. I’m hoping to catch a Black Friday deal today...if you know one too! Thanks in advance!


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Re: Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by DamageWagon » Sat Nov 30, 2019 1:13 am

You can run up to 37’s on your stock wheels. No need to go to new wheels. A better wheel offset does help but isn’t necessary if you run a 37x12.5R17 tire; anything wider and you might want the better wheel offset or you might not care.

Load Range doesn’t really tell you anything technical. Load Index tells true carrying capacity, and each tire is constructed differently regardless of load range. For instance the Toyo MT in a 37”xXXR17 tire comes in two widths, 12.5 load range D and 13.5 (actually 14.4) load range E. In speaking with a Toyo engineer, the difference between the two is that the 13.5 has more air volume and has a slight change to its interior that allows 80psi over the 50psi of the 12.5. Hence, higher load carrying capacity.

Toyo RT is a pretty good tire and shares the internal construction of the MT.

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Re: Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by PWPunchinAZ » Sun Dec 01, 2019 9:46 pm

Thank you @damagewagon. Perhaps I misspoke. I thought Load range also referred to the amount of ply a tire had. This is my first 2500 size truck. I’m not familiar with how the heavier truck affects which tire is best to get. I am in areas where sharp random rocks are a concern. The stock tires I have now are horrible. I hold my breath every time I drive to work. Praying I don’t get ANOTHER flat. So I was wondering if the Toyo rt were going to have ample ply for these big trucks? So I don’t have to be constantly concerned about flats. I don’t live in the city. I need a tough tire that will withstand the hazards of ranch life. While still looking good doing it.

Is there anything special about the stock wheels, that I should consider as a reason to keep them? I really like the look of the blitz wheel. I was hoping to find out from others who’ve experience with them. How they’ve held up? Are they tough enough for daily ranch life... or are they more of a city wheel?

As I’ve been shopping around. I’ve gotten mixed feedback from these tire vendors. Some say the 35’s will fit fine. Then some say I need a 3-5” lift. Or I’ll have to do some heavy modifications. (I’m thinking they are trying to sell me a lift-grrr! ). Now you say I can go up to a 37”. If I go with the configuration of toyo rt 35/12.5/18 & fuel off-road blitz 18x165 -12. Will they fit with no modding necessary? And will I have any rub? Will the 35’s make any difference in filling up more of the wheel well space? It’s a visual aesthetic aspect that has really begun to bother me. I’d like to achieve a more proportional look. Not a BIG TRUCK on itty bitty tires... lol.

Thank you again for responding & the information you shared. I sincerely do appreciate it


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Re: Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by PWJouster » Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:32 am

the issue with the stock rim is purely the width of it, and accepting a wider tire, with a wider contact patch. Wider 35s or 37s deserve a wider rim to justify said tread size difference.

a 12.5 tire tread contact patch will not sit correctly on a 8 inch rim....in fact, it is probably not an "approved width"

in saying that...people do it...it works...you wont die..
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Re: Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by Bill2014 » Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:49 am

PWJouster wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:32 am
the issue with the stock rim is purely the width of it, and accepting a wider tire, with a wider contact patch. Wider 35s or 37s deserve a wider rim to justify said tread size difference.

a 12.5 tire tread contact patch will not sit correctly on a 8 inch rim....in fact, it is probably not an "approved width"

in saying that...people do it...it works...you wont die..
X2

On a semi-related note, I had rim width discussions with Interco on the 36x13.5R17LT IROC radial. They insist that that tire was designed for a 10" wide rim. When I pushed them on using a 9" wide rim i got the response: "Will it work on a 9" wide wheel, yes. It is just not suggested for maximum performance."

Our stock Power Wagon rims are super strong - most after-market rims won't hold up to the abuse they will handle under our heavy beasts.

The OEM Power Wagon tires were designed for a 8.5" wide rim (yet our trucks came with 8"). They are "approved" to be used on a rim that is 7.5"-9.0" in width. It's too bad the PW's didn't come with 8.5" or even 9.0" rims. :cry:
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Re: Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by DamageWagon » Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:10 am

A narrower rim causes more sidewalk bulge and creates more retention of the bed, and more tire compliance to terrain.

A wider rim causes a more natural contact patch of the tire tread to the ground.

It’s all in what you want it to do. I run 37x12.5r17 on my 8.0” wheels and I like them. They’ve performed better than they should in bead retention. Tire wear is pretty consistent for me, which is surprising for Toyo MT’s because they already tend to wear faster in the center than the edges, and you’d think a narrow rim would make that worse.

Tire mfg’s have their own wheel specs, and tire installers like Discount have their own. 8” wheels aren’t spec’d for my tires per Toyo but Discount said they were. I wouldn’t overthink this one too much. I’ll go with a slightly wider wheel next time but I prefer not having 10” wheels for my specific use case because of how straight it makes the sidewall and how that affects ride quality and bead retention.

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Re: Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by RustyPW » Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:11 pm

Here's a 35" Cooper MT at 18 psi on the stock 17x8 rim. Note the amount of flex in the tire sidewall. The tire didn't come off the rim at all. The picture was taken on my first trip to Moab.

Just about everyone replaces the oem tires with 35" on stock rims.
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Re: Making new tire & wheel plunge

Post by TommyDuncan » Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:29 am

DamageWagon wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:10 am
A narrower rim causes more sidewalk bulge and creates more retention of the bed, and more tire compliance to terrain.

A wider rim causes a more natural contact patch of the tire tread to the ground.

It’s all in what you want it to do. I run 37x12.5r17 on my 8.0” wheels and I like them. They’ve performed better than they should in bead retention. Tire wear is pretty consistent for me, which is surprising for Toyo MT’s because they already tend to wear faster in the center than the edges, and you’d think a narrow rim would make that worse.

Tire mfg’s have their own wheel specs, and tire installers like Discount have their own. 8” wheels aren’t spec’d for my tires per Toyo but Discount said they were. I wouldn’t overthink this one too much. I’ll go with a slightly wider wheel next time but I prefer not having 10” wheels for my specific use case because of how straight it makes the sidewall and how that affects ride quality and bead retention.
We've actually proven this, although on a lighter vehicle.

Back in my Samurai days, while on a budget, I accidentally bought 3 8" wide wheels and one 9" wide wheel. We figured it out when one tire kept coming off the bead when aired down to 10psi.

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