2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

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2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Tue May 29, 2018 11:43 am

I thought the surging I was getting was a result of the lifter/cam issue I had. I've got the truck back after the new cam and 16 lifters and had a chance to pull the boat this weekend and the surging seems to have gotten worse. My best estimate is that the surging had nothing to do with the bad lifter/cam and was just coincidental. The surging is most prevalent under part throttle under load (such as going up a hill in 5th or 6th with the converter locked and even just steady mph with converter locked in 5th and 6th). It is also noticeable at moderate to light acceleration around 1500-1900rpm. I have no codes that i'm aware of (don't have a scanner, just going from what I see on my dash readouts). From what I gather egr replacement is a likely solution to this issue. Are there 2015s out there having the EGR valves replaced for this behavior? I know there is a TSB for the 2016 trucks. If my EGR valve is the culprit is that covered under warranty?

Truck has 55k on the clock.

I've already asked the dealer but they are "busy" right now.

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by Reloaderguy » Tue May 29, 2018 12:01 pm

What is the TSB for the 16 trucks?
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Tue May 29, 2018 12:06 pm

Reloaderguy wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 12:01 pm
What is the TSB for the 16 trucks?
I don't know. Perhaps our favorite FCA expert can chime in!

I just exchanged a few messages with the dealer. Looks like the EGR wouldn't be covered by the warranty. I can tell you my patience is running very thin with this truck. To think I stayed away from emissions diesels thinking late model gas motors were reliable.......

F'ing 12v I had in my 97 had 180hp when I got it and when I sold it was making 600hp. Never had a damn issue like this and i'd modified near everything on that truck aside from the shortblock. Haven't even touched this 6.4. Really really frustrating......

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by DamageWagon » Tue May 29, 2018 12:46 pm

I’m liking my 5.7 more and more...

Is there an emissions delete kit? I think there is for the 5.7. You’ll still have cats and all that good stuff but if you can ditch EGR you might be in a much better spot

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Tue May 29, 2018 12:54 pm

DamageWagon wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 12:46 pm
I’m liking my 5.7 more and more...

Is there an emissions delete kit? I think there is for the 5.7. You’ll still have cats and all that good stuff but if you can ditch EGR you might be in a much better spot
The issue with this I believe is I wouldn't be able to pass emissions if I deleted the EGR. If not for that I would do it in a heart beat. My truck is a 2015 so I don't believe I can clear codes which would fail me so far as I understand it.

I'm exploring the idea of replacing it myself.

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by olyelr » Tue May 29, 2018 1:08 pm

This surging you are talking about... you mean like a shudder type feeling under those driving circumstances?

I have read a few or more threads about this, and I have never seen anyone who has pinpointed the root cause or had it remedied. My truck does it as well ('16). It is annoying AF. Pretty much my only complaint about this truck so far.

What is this EGR stuff? I have no emissions to pass, and if it is easy to by-pass/delete it I am willing to try for sure. For the love of God, anything to make it go away.
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Tue May 29, 2018 1:16 pm

olyelr, google some more. There are many threads about the part throttle surging and egr tsb for 2016s. I can't find anything for 2015s but the behavior described is identical. Start here......
http://www.ramforumz.com/showthread.php ... ics/229008

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by olyelr » Tue May 29, 2018 2:25 pm

NickTF wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 1:16 pm
olyelr, google some more. There are many threads about the part throttle surging and egr tsb for 2016s. I can't find anything for 2015s but the behavior described is identical. Start here......
http://www.ramforumz.com/showthread.php ... ics/229008

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by waldo » Wed May 30, 2018 11:51 am

My 16 had a low RPM surge just off idle going uphill. Held too high of a gear. I complained about it and they did nothing until the campaign came out on the EGR valve.

Guess what went away when they put in a new one?
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Wed May 30, 2018 12:12 pm

I have little doubt that the EGR is my problem. Trying to explain these things to folks who believe damaged camshafts "sound normal" is not an easy task. The fact that it isn't under warranty is even more frustrating. I will likely end up replacing this myself depending on what all needs to be removed.

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by waldo » Wed May 30, 2018 12:25 pm

NickTF wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 12:12 pm
I have little doubt that the EGR is my problem. Trying to explain these things to folks who believe damaged camshafts "sound normal" is not an easy task. The fact that it isn't under warranty is even more frustrating. I will likely end up replacing this myself depending on what all needs to be removed.

EGR is an emissions part, isn't it? Should be covered under the emissions warranty which is longer. Getting them to do it without a failed test might be another ball of wax though.
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Wed May 30, 2018 12:33 pm

waldo wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 12:25 pm
NickTF wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 12:12 pm
I have little doubt that the EGR is my problem. Trying to explain these things to folks who believe damaged camshafts "sound normal" is not an easy task. The fact that it isn't under warranty is even more frustrating. I will likely end up replacing this myself depending on what all needs to be removed.

EGR is an emissions part, isn't it? Should be covered under the emissions warranty which is longer. Getting them to do it without a failed test might be another ball of wax though.
I've had the truck since February 2015 and have just under 56,000 miles on the clock. I think i'm out of that coverage but I need to look. Yes, most definitely on the "failed test" deal. The surging i'm experiencing is part of the reason the tech agreed to look further into my motor and eventually finding my damaged cam, that and the obvious valve train issue sound.

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Wed May 30, 2018 12:40 pm

Just googled the 2015 2500/3500 gas warranty. EGR looks like it is covered to 5 years/50k so i'm out of luck!

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by TwinStick » Wed May 30, 2018 12:51 pm

This stuff is super frustrating to say the least. They want you to give them your hard earned money for the truck, then are not capable of diagnosing/fixing it !!! :angry:
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G-56 Gear ratios: 1st) 6.29:1 2nd) 3.48:1 3rd) 2.10:1 4th) 1.38:1 5th) 1.0:1 6th) 0.79:1 Rev 6.29:1 --- = 78.01613:1 Crawl Ratio
-------------------------5.94:1--------3.28:1-------1.98:1-------1.31:1-------1.0:1-------0.74:1-----5.42:1 ---- = 73.675:1
545RFE----------------3.0:1---------1.67:1--------1.0:1--------0.75:1-------0.67:1------------------3.0:1 -------=37.21:1

2013+ 32.47 crawl ratio...............Can you see the trend ??????????????

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by waldo » Wed May 30, 2018 12:53 pm

I think it's 8-80,000 federally if it fails a test. That's probably going to be your sticking point.
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Wed May 30, 2018 12:58 pm

TwinStick wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 12:51 pm
This stuff is super frustrating to say the least. They want you to give them your hard earned money for the truck, then are not capable of diagnosing/fixing it !!! :angry:
Especially when you use the truck to travel for your main job and to take care of your side work (lawn mowing/trimming primarily, occasional power washing). Makes me laugh when I see the ram commercials showing these trucks in work scenarios........

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by KevinABQ » Wed May 30, 2018 3:42 pm

There were a bunch of guys in Moab who use them in the oil fields.
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by Retired BLM Rig » Thu May 31, 2018 9:42 am

The TSB # is 25-004-16
The RRT # is 16-096

You won't find it doing an internet search, maybe because it starts with this statement:
This bulletin is supplied as technical information only and is not an authorization for repair. No part of this publication may be reproduced, stored in a retrieval system, or transmitted, in any form or by any means, electronic, mechanical, photocopying, or otherwise, without written permission of FCA US LLC.

Basically all the TSB says is that the technician should check the serial # on the EGR valve and if it falls in a certain range and the owner has a complaint to replace it with part #04627465AF and gasket #04627612AA.

The TSB does not include the serial number list (apparently part of some other document).
It applies to 2016 trucks built before June 10, 2016 with the 6.4 Hemi.
It does say that "ALL REPAIRS ARE REIMBURSABLE WITHIN THE PROVISIONS OF WARRANTY."

The fact that the replacement part number ends with AF tells me that it's in it's sixth iteration.
I don't work for FCA but I do have access to TSB's.
Last edited by Retired BLM Rig on Thu May 31, 2018 10:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Thu May 31, 2018 9:53 am

As always your input is very much appreciated. Thanks!

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by Reloaderguy » Thu May 31, 2018 11:13 am

This thread is proof that warranties are worth fuckall for a vehicle this complex. BLM is the man, I'd just order the part and put it in yourself.
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by Sweet5ltr » Thu May 31, 2018 12:45 pm

Nick,

I was one of the first to post about a surging issue in 2016 with my 2015 PW. It may be the same issue, under light acceleration the truck would surge / hesitate, like the engine was running incredibly lean. I tried everything at that point, tanks of 87 octane, 87-93 mix (true 89), 93 octane, placed my scanner on it, and it never created any codes while running in this condition. It didn't matter if the coolant temp was 160* or 215*, trans temp was cold or hot, the truck displayed the same issues. It would smooth right out with additional throttle input, or simply leaving the truck in tow-haul to avoid this RPM range all together (my original thread title was 15' PW 1500 RPM Stumble), this solution only worked during city driving and not interstate commuting. The only solution at that point from other owners, was a real tune, which required a new, cracked ECU from diablosport; $1,000+. The dealership was clueless in early-2016.

Well, my prayer was answered this year when I had the 'list' prior to the end of my 36-month/3-year bumper-to-bumper warranty period. All 6.4 Rams (2015) should have been recalled to have this done. It's a completely different driving experience.

Here was the solution, PCM reflash, it's in the technical bulletin:
https://chrysler.oemdtc.com/356/flash-d ... s-2015-ram
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Thu May 31, 2018 2:30 pm

You know the first dealer I took my truck to, which told me my valve train noise was normal when I had a chunk missing from my cam, told me they performed a flash to fix surging. I just called them and asked them what flashes they performed about a month later. They did not perform any such flash. Further, I just noticed that the intake boot around my throttle body was completely and totally loose with the worm gear bolt/clamp loose as hell. I went home and tightened it hoping that was my surging problem but ofcourse it wasn't. My coolant reservoir also looks like someone took a chit in it. It was totally clean when I took the truck in to have the cam and lifters replaced. I just can't f'ing tell you how disappointed I am with all of this. This truck isn't a leisure sportscar owned by a rich dummy, it's owned by me who uses it to make a living and have fun with his family. The incompetence and dishonesty prevalent in today's service sectors are maddening (have had a bad run of luck with HVAC contractors and marine mechanics as well). I honestly think maybe 15% of folks give a damn about anything any more. I do appreciate the 15% contributing to this thread. Hopefully I can get to a place soon where I don't feel like FCA bent me over and screwed me out of $40k for a bran new 2015 PW tradesman...

Edit: Taking truck in Wed to have the following looked into:
1. The coolant reservoir which looks like a jobsite porta john now
2. The available reflashes which may solve the surging
3. Going to talk to them more about the oil pressure drop and why mine reads 24 hot idle while everyone i've talked to with a 6.4 reads 30 at hot idle. The oil pressure drop showed up when the cam/lifter noise did and appears too coincidental to be an issue with a sender.
Last edited by NickTF on Thu May 31, 2018 3:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by Sweet5ltr » Thu May 31, 2018 2:49 pm

Nick, please go to the service center ASAP and have them do the flash, it's considered .2 hours labor, the service bulletin states it takes around 5-minutes to actually perform the PCM reflash. At least at that point, it could be another (check) marked off the list on potential causes and/or solutions. Hope you get it worked out, I've went through 5-dealerships so far servicing my fleet vehicles, finally made a commitment to stay with one service / truck shop, even though they aren't perfect, they've been the least incompetent so far.
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by Sweet5ltr » Thu May 31, 2018 2:51 pm

** Nick, be sure to print this out and bring it with you. Tell them this is exactly what you want done (as being verified your PCM has this update), as your truck has been hesitating and stuttering, and other members of a RAM forum have found this to be a solution.

https://chrysler.oemdtc.com/TSB/18-097-16.pdf
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Re: 2015 6.4 Hemi EGR Issues?

Post by NickTF » Thu May 31, 2018 2:58 pm

Thanks. I will certainly do just as you say.

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