Has anyone replaced their front tow hooks?

agpilot · Post by **agpilot** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:52 am

I was browsing Ebay yesterday and came across a guy selling some pretty beefy shackle mounts that replace the factory tow hooks: link
Has anyone installed these? I'm thinking about swapping on mine so I can use in conjunction with a D-ring Hi-lift adapter to safely lift the truck when it's on 37s.

Those welds don't look amazing but I think I might order a set and see what they look like in person. I'll keep everyone posted.

FirerescuePW · Post by **FirerescuePW** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 1:08 pm

I believe they have been discussed. I like the looks of them. I do, however, wonder about off- center pulls. That could be alot of leverage to the side, since they are so long.Let us know how the gussets are set up.

Another thing to consider-is everything just set on the surface of the plate and then welded? If so, you are completely dependent on the weld strength. If the square stock is through a hole in the plate and welded on both sides, that would offer a little more strength. That is how I would do it.

Our OEM hooks are cast as one piece, so the integrity is in the material, not a weld.

Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

Colibri · Post by **Colibri** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 1:36 pm

The stock tow points are pretty beefy and are more suited to off angle pulls than those. Plus, you can hook the winch directly to them without a shackle thereby eliminating a point of failure.

agpilot · Post by **agpilot** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 2:04 pm

Colibri wrote:The stock tow points are pretty beefy and are more suited to off angle pulls than those. Plus, you can hook the winch directly to them without a shackle thereby eliminating a point of failure.

I agree. I've used the stock hooks as recovery points and hooked the winch back to them when using a snatch block. The only reason I was looking to change them is I wanted a way to safely lift the front of the truck using a high-lift once I am lifted and on 37s. The stock tow hooks don't really stick out far enough or engage well enough with a high lift. I can lift the rear using the receiver hitch with a shackle mount in it (although far from ideal).

I went ahead and ordered these. I'll get my calipers out and take some measurements and inspect the welds as best I can. I also wanted to make a little more room behind the bumper so I can mount some Rigid XL lights on either side of the winch. The stock tow hooks interfered and I needed about 1/2" more clearance which got me looking in the first place.

Looks like there are receiver hitch variations on this idea as well, which, had I seen before I pulled the trigger on Ebay, I might have been inclined to get instead.

Another option I am looking at to make more room behind the bumper is to go with Ram 5500 hooks mounted lower.

agpilot · Post by **agpilot** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 2:09 pm

FirerescuePW wrote:I believe they have been discussed. I like the looks of them. I do, however, wonder about off- center pulls. That could be alot of leverage to the side, since they are so long.Let us know how the gussets are set up.

Another thing to consider-is everything just set on the surface of the plate and then welded? If so, you are completely dependent on the weld strength. If the square stock is through a hole in the plate and welded on both sides, that would offer a little more strength. That is how I would do it.

Our OEM hooks are cast as one piece, so the integrity is in the material, not a weld.

Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

These are concerns I have as well. We'll see what the part looks like when it arrives. If the welds are super sketchy, it's not going on my truck. But doing some pixel measurement using the 7/8 shackle as reference measurement the bar stock looks about 1" thick and the mounting plate looks to be 1/4" thick steel. Assuming an appropriate welding process and good penetration, I think they will be more than sturdy enough vs the cast hooks. I definitely agree that the skookum way to build would be to cut a hole in the plate and put the bar through and weld both sides. I might end up fabricobbling something better together if these don't measure up.

Rodeoflyer · Post by **Rodeoflyer** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 3:09 pm

Another option would be to fabricobble something like this but heavier duty. This is an nfab light bar mount that mounts to the same bolts as the factory tow hooks under the factory hooks retaining them as I didn't want to lose my tow hooks for a lightbar mount. Its my engine bay step/light bar mount. I would never try to lift the truck by it but something heavier duty would work if you just want a hi lift jack point w/o going full aftermarket bumper. I've always wondered if that thing was plate steel I could use it as a hi lift point.
https://imgur.com/xzVwO3C
https://imgur.com/9QWoZfH

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

Reloaderguy · Post by **Reloaderguy** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 4:58 pm

The tow hook isn't the problem, it's what they're mounted to that needs to be stronger.

Rodeoflyer · Post by **Rodeoflyer** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 5:35 pm

This is going to get interesting

. Stronger for tow hooks or stronger as a high lift point?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Reloaderguy · Post by **Reloaderguy** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:21 pm

The tow hooks mount to sheet metal. Look under your bumper. If you get pulled by your tow hook you will likely bend your bumper.

Colibri · Post by **Colibri** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:58 pm

agpilot wrote:
Colibri wrote:The stock tow points are pretty beefy and are more suited to off angle pulls than those. Plus, you can hook the winch directly to them without a shackle thereby eliminating a point of failure.
I agree. I've used the stock hooks as recovery points and hooked the winch back to them when using a snatch block. The only reason I was looking to change them is I wanted a way to safely lift the front of the truck using a high-lift once I am lifted and on 37s. The stock tow hooks don't really stick out far enough or engage well enough with a high lift. I can lift the rear using the receiver hitch with a shackle mount in it (although far from ideal).

I went ahead and ordered these. I'll get my calipers out and take some measurements and inspect the welds as best I can. I also wanted to make a little more room behind the bumper so I can mount some Rigid XL lights on either side of the winch. The stock tow hooks interfered and I needed about 1/2" more clearance which got me looking in the first place.

Looks like there are receiver hitch variations on this idea as well, which, had I seen before I pulled the trigger on Ebay, I might have been inclined to get instead.

Another option I am looking at to make more room behind the bumper is to go with Ram 5500 hooks mounted lower.

Ah gotcha, good luck with them then. Just watch out for the hilift crunching the hood or grille. I've had to use a hilift off a bumper a few times and it's always iffy with the sheet metal. I know it's unavoidable sometimes but I hate doing it lol.

Ducky's Dad · Post by **Ducky's Dad** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:07 pm

https://imgur.com/xzVwO3C

I have one of those N-Fab light bars on my Tundra, and the bar is a complete piece of crap. Regardless of what it's mounted to, I wouldn't trust the welds or the bends.

YouTube · Post by **OffroadTreks** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:24 pm

Those welds look like a blind man did it.

Rodeoflyer · Post by **Rodeoflyer** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 9:26 pm

Ducky's Dad wrote:
https://imgur.com/xzVwO3C
I have one of those N-Fab light bars on my Tundra, and the bar is a complete piece of crap. Regardless of what it's mounted to, I wouldn't trust the welds or the bends.

For a light bar or standing on? Other options mounting a bracket directly to the bumper, grille, brodude 50+'' roof mount or hood glare.

There's nothing wrong with this lightbar mount welds notwithstanding and it retains the factory tow hooks. Build a better one I'll buy it

.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ducky's Dad · Post by **Ducky's Dad** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:19 pm

For a light bar or standing on? Other options mounting a bracket directly to the bumper, grille, brodude 50+'' roof mount or hood glare.

There's nothing wrong with this lightbar mount welds notwithstanding and it retains the factory tow hooks. Build a better one I'll buy it .

The one on my Tundra is not suitable for lifting or standing or lights. The welds suck, the bends suck, the powder coating sucks, and the damned thing wasn't even jigged right when they welded it, holes did not line up with the mounting points on the truck so I had to hog out most of the holes in the N-Fab mounts. Looked like it was welded by a blind monkey. I called N-Fab to complain, got nowhere because I had hogged out the holes to get it onto the truck. It's still not straight or level, but it's on the truck until I can find or build something better. Complete piece of crap and a waste of money and time. You'd think that with all the aftermarket support for Toyotas, there would be a better choice.

The bar on my PW is from Defiant Truck Products and I love it, but Defiant is out of business. They did offer one for the Tundra, but that was before I bought the Tundra.

agpilot · Post by **agpilot** » Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:36 pm

MikeKey wrote:Those welds look like a blind man did it.

I took the risk and ordered them. I'm *hoping* that it's just because it was stick welded which would be appropriate for the thickness of material. My fear is it's crappy MIG done by a blind man. If so, I can return it for the cost of a USPS flat rate box.

Rodeoflyer · Post by **Rodeoflyer** » Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:29 am

Ducky's Dad wrote:
For a light bar or standing on? Other options mounting a bracket directly to the bumper, grille, brodude 50+'' roof mount or hood glare.

There's nothing wrong with this lightbar mount welds notwithstanding and it retains the factory tow hooks. Build a better one I'll buy it .
The one on my Tundra is not suitable for lifting or standing or lights. The welds suck, the bends suck, the powder coating sucks, and the damned thing wasn't even jigged right when they welded it, holes did not line up with the mounting points on the truck so I had to hog out most of the holes in the N-Fab mounts. Looked like it was welded by a blind monkey. I called N-Fab to complain, got nowhere because I had hogged out the holes to get it onto the truck. It's still not straight or level, but it's on the truck until I can find or build something better. Complete piece of crap and a waste of money and time. You'd think that with all the aftermarket support for Toyotas, there would be a better choice.

The bar on my PW is from Defiant Truck Products and I love it, but Defiant is out of business. They did offer one for the Tundra, but that was before I bought the Tundra.

I can jump up and down on mine at 200#'s. Maybe their manufacturing has improved. I've had zero problems with it and it's really nice for standing on when under the hood. I have a quick disconnect for the lightbar and remove when I don't need it. People around here will steal anything that's not bolted down

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

trk4sale · Post by **trk4sale** » Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:26 am

Three words come to my mind
Clank, Clank, Clank!

Rodeoflyer · Post by **Rodeoflyer** » Sun Jun 18, 2017 11:36 am

Yeah you will probably hear those shackles! I did check out the mounting points like reloaderguy suggested and the hooks are inline mounted to (what appears to be cause you never know) a heavy bumper support bracket that attaches to the same frame point as the winch. I would think it would be fine but if someone has pulled their bumper out using the tow hooks he may have seen or heard about it. Very interesting.

I found a post discussing this. The tow hook brackets and the hooks themselves have oblong mounting holes (noticed this when I removed them) for adjustment so if you use the recovery hooks and they're not torqued down the bumper and bracket can shift. Not a problem imo but can happen.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

agpilot · Post by **agpilot** » Tue Jun 27, 2017 12:35 pm

Well, I received the new "tow hooks" from Ebay today. First impressions? Well as my favorite youtuber says, she's definitely got some gravity to her. Nearly 11# with the shackle hanging from it. It feels incredibly solid.

According to the seller, it is fabricated using A36 steel 1x3" bar stock welded to 3/8" plate. The gussets are 1/4" and fully welded. The welds were done with the hot glue gun of welders (MIG) and are not amazing looking but seem sufficient. There was definitely a lot of heat put into the part because the 3/8" base is warped across the long axis ever so slightly. I'm curious why they didn't use the holes to fixture the plate flat before welding. I suppose this is encouraging from a penetration standpoint, but as FirerescuePW had noted earlier, it would have been better to have the bar go through the plate and weld both sides.

I'm on the fence about mounting these in place of the factory hooks. While they would definitely give me the extra width I am looking for to mount lights inside the bumper and provide high lift points in the front that stick out a little further, I don't have a warm fuzzy about the strength of these though it is probably sufficient.

Worst case scenario - I got two 6.5T WLL shackles for about $100 bucks.

Post by **DamageWagon** » Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:06 pm

I'm not so big of a fan of how much leverage that shackle has. Maybe it's needed, but that hole would be better more towards the base.

The welds are strong but there should be more passes on the main bar coming out of the 3/8".

Cutting a hole through the 3/8" and welding the back side would probably weaken it rather than strengthen it. You would be taking away a lot of the meat of the 3/8 plate and replacing it with another member, and then even when you weld the back side you still have to grind it flush again. This still adds some weld bead but I wouldn't want to eat away that bolt plate too much to allow that big bar to fit inside.

That setup is probably stronger than factory in a straight pull. Factory is cast steel and very strong, great design, and I love that the Mopar "M" gives you a tow strap hookup... On the other hand, cast steel just brittle fractures rather than giving you some warning. That new bar will bend a little bit and deform the gussets/base plate before failure (if you see it in time).

My $.02

agpilot · Post by **agpilot** » Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:20 pm

DamageWagon wrote:I'm not so big of a fan of how much leverage that shackle has. Maybe it's needed, but that hole would be better more towards the base.

The welds are strong but there should be more passes on the main bar coming out of the 3/8".

Cutting a hole through the 3/8" and welding the back side would probably weaken it rather than strengthen it. You would be taking away a lot of the meat of the 3/8 plate and replacing it with another member, and then even when you weld the back side you still have to grind it flush again. This still adds some weld bead but I wouldn't want to eat away that bolt plate too much to allow that big bar to fit inside.

That setup is probably stronger than factory in a straight pull. Factory is cast steel and very strong, great design, and I love that the Mopar "M" gives you a tow strap hookup... On the other hand, cast steel just brittle fractures rather than giving you some warning. That new bar will bend a little bit and deform the gussets/base plate before failure (if you see it in time).

My $.02

Thanks for your comments. I agree on the additional passes on the main bar to 3/8 joint. I seem to recall the rule of thumb is a fillet the thickness of the thinner material being joined. As far as leverage goes, the hole needs to be that far out so the shackle can hang straight down past the bumper and doesn't rest on it. As far as construction goes, I'm inclined now to agree with you. I was thinking about a 1" square peg (cut shoulders on the bar) going through the plate and then ground flat after welding both sides to give some lateral rigidity but either way, that is more machining operations and cost. I think it's pretty beefy as is.

I wanted it so I could get the lifting arm of a high lift out away from the bumper a little to jack the truck in the front because the factory tow hooks are recessed pretty deep in the bumper I'd be afraid I wouldn't get good purchase. Also, I want to mount some rigid XL (4" square) lights next to the tow hooks on both sides. They would have interfered with the freespool lever and the remote jack if I couldn't get the additional width. If I can make all that work, I'll post pics of the install.

YouTube · Post by **OffroadTreks** » Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:23 pm

So wait, you're going to mount lights to them next?

agpilot · Post by **agpilot** » Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:56 pm

MikeKey wrote:So wait, you're going to mount lights to them next?

Next to them like this but bigger lights.

Reloaderguy · Post by **Reloaderguy** » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:01 pm

DamageWagon wrote:I'm not so big of a fan of how much leverage that shackle has. Maybe it's needed, but that hole would be better more towards the base.

The welds are strong but there should be more passes on the main bar coming out of the 3/8".

Cutting a hole through the 3/8" and welding the back side would probably weaken it rather than strengthen it. You would be taking away a lot of the meat of the 3/8 plate and replacing it with another member, and then even when you weld the back side you still have to grind it flush again. This still adds some weld bead but I wouldn't want to eat away that bolt plate too much to allow that big bar to fit inside.

That setup is probably stronger than factory in a straight pull. Factory is cast steel and very strong, great design, and I love that the Mopar "M" gives you a tow strap hookup... On the other hand, cast steel just brittle fractures rather than giving you some warning. That new bar will bend a little bit and deform the gussets/base plate before failure (if you see it in time).

My $.02

None of that even matters, the factory tow hooks exceed the strength of their mount. It only looks like they are frame mounted, the tow hooks and bumper mount to two sheet metal boxes. A high lift under the new shackle mount will pretzel the bumper and mount.

YouTube · Post by **OffroadTreks** » Tue Jun 27, 2017 3:23 pm

Reloaderguy wrote: None of that even matters, the factory tow hooks exceed the strength of their mount. It only looks like they are frame mounted, the tow hooks and bumper mount to two sheet metal boxes. A high lift under the new shackle mount will pretzel the bumper and mount.

You're basing that on what?

Those boxes ARE mounted to the frame, and they are not sheet metal. Bolts go into what is a cap over the front of the frame, then it wraps the frame and there were two additional bolts on each side into the frame. The winch is wedged on one side. My bumper came with a spacer plate to recreate this when I removed mine.

However, based on how they mounted, I do agree they could shift and pretezel the bumper with applied force.

Power Wagon Registry