Airing down how low?

If it's about Power Wagons, all generations, this is where it'll go. This is the original PWR Forum Power Wagon Technical Discussion Section. And this includes everything that doesn’t fit in any one of the other categories related to the truck goes here!
Post Reply
User avatar
chromedragon
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 144
Joined: Thu May 31, 2012 2:20 pm
Contact:

Airing down how low?

Post by chromedragon » Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:10 pm

Hello everyone,

I am getting further and further into wandering into the back woods areas of Cali. One of the trip reports to an area i want to explore noted that they aired down there tires for the area in question. The trucks being used were Toyota Taco's and Mitsubishi Monteros.

My question is how low do any of you run your tires when out exploring in back country areas. The manual says down to 15 psi but that scares me with my normal operating load in the 60-70 range.

Can any one comment on your experience. i'm just making sure i don't end up in the back woods with a poped bead on a tire. I know the wheels i have don't have bead locks.

For reference im running Cooper Discover ATP tires LT285/70R17E1 121S W

any feed back would be welcome

Tony
2006 Power Wagon Quad Cab Manual Moto Rims stock size, Cooper ATP, Dynatrac Ball joints, Dynatrac Free spin kit with Warn hubs, AmSteel blue 7/16 x 100' synthetics rope from Custom splice, Sony BT 602 stereo and backup camera etc. Rancho 9000XL adjustable shocks.

Special Licenses:
FAA Airframe and Power Plant
FCC Technician (Ham) KK6YCI

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
"No statement should be believed because it is made by an authority.

Robert A. Heinlein

User avatar
Cactus Red
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1862
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 6:43 pm
Location: Chino Valley, AZ.

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by Cactus Red » Mon Mar 17, 2014 5:04 pm

I start at 25 PSI, and adjust lower as needed. I've gone as low as 10 PSI, but you stand a pretty good chance of losing the bead at that - I have even with the stock PW rims.

The ride and traction greatly improve at 25 PSI or so, but fuel economy take a pretty substantial hit, and going lower only makes that worse. I usually see 9 to 10 MPG in the 22 to 25 PSI range, if you get into the teens, figure 6 to 8 MPG.

The 12 hour day trip I took two weekends ago used 23 gallons of gas in 170+ miles, and that was with tires in the 20 PSI range. I've seen the overhead show 4 or 5 MPG in snow or sand.

Mark
I'm just along for the ride...

User avatar
RAM4ROKS
500_Posts
500_Posts
Posts: 980
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 5:48 pm

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by RAM4ROKS » Mon Mar 17, 2014 5:58 pm

I go down to about 13 up front and 11 in the rear. I'm on 37x12.50R17 MTRKs though. With stock tires I wouldn't go below 25psi because I needed all the ground clearance I could get!!! On a funny note- time before last that I went wheeling, I didn't air down at all (was being lazy) then, this past time, I aired down to 12[F]/10[R] and kept catching the top 1" of rocks on the trail repeatedly! (just the 1" of clearance I lost by airing down, LOL!) Pay attention to your new (lower) clearance when you air down!

User avatar
Chiprat1
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 122
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2012 7:42 pm

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by Chiprat1 » Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:33 pm

On Borad Air........... 20 max for me, even though the PW does have a better Rim, for this, if you do not ahve On-board air, or not with those who do, be cautious, even 30 is better than 60 or 45...
2006 Power Wagon
Line X – 2in Front Leveler (Pro Comp), Hard wired Lockers, Front Fog Lights,
35in KM2’s, De-Politicized Winch (No LVI, Etc)
5th Wheel hitch

1980 CJ7 – Rino Lined, 33x12.50 Pro Comp AMC 360ci
1974 CJ7 – AMC 304ci, Beaten but fun “Brush Buggy”
Kaw Brute 650 – One Bad 4x4, winch, 12 lights

:winchmob:

User avatar
coder
1000_Posts
1000_Posts
Posts: 1265
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:18 pm
Model Year: 2007
Location: Ladera Ranch, CA

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by coder » Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:11 pm

With 35" tires 20 psi front/rear is what I run with a fully loaded truck on multi-day trips out in the desert (rocks, sand, snow, mud, hard-packed dirt roads, etc.) it seems to work real well. With an empty truck in really soft sand you could go lower maybe 10-15 psi but I never have needed too.
Vehicle: 2007 Power Wagon Quad Cab - Inferno Red
Suspension: Carli 3" Hemi Coils, Carli Control Arms, Carli King 2.5 Pin-Tops, Carli Stainless Steering Stabilizer, Carli Trackbar | Synergy 1" Rear Shackle
Performance: Magnaflow Muffler | Magnaflow Y-Pipe
Wheels/Tires: Toyo AT II's 35x12.5x17
Steering/Drivetrain/Axles: Carli Front Diff Guard | Dynatrac Ball Joints | Mopar HD Steering Gear
Miscellaneous: Line-X Bedliner | Locker Bypass Switch | Mopar Rock Rails | DieHard Platinum Battery G65 | Performance Friction Brake Pads | Weathertech Digital Fit Mats | Winch Thermal Protection Bypass

User avatar
fbenross
500_Posts
500_Posts
Posts: 593
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:35 pm
Location: Moss Beach CA

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by fbenross » Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:16 pm

I run about a half pound less in the right rear to increase forward bite comin out of the corners.
Ben CW3 2/10th AIR CAV FT ORD CA. (retired)
2006 Power Wagon-6spd, rear air bags, Diff Guards:Carli F. RockCrusher R., matching rim for spare tire, removed back seat for storage----I own the following: 2005 Hallmark pop-top Camper---1970 Scout 800 4x4 w/232ci 6cyl 4spd---2006 Yamaha XT225 Dual Sport---Pictures @ https://www.flickr.com/photos/powerwagon/collections

azracer
1000_Posts
1000_Posts
Posts: 1368
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:34 pm

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by azracer » Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:53 pm

fbenross wrote:I run about a half pound less in the right rear to increase forward bite comin out of the corners.
I could have sworn it was a pound and a half less and was to help keep traction through the corner. :doh:
My build 2009 3G
http://forum.powerwagonregistry.org/vie ... =13&t=2305

Beginners reading list:
1) Quigley’s Anglo-American Establishment – 354 pages http://www.carrollquigley.net/pdf/the_a ... shment.pdf
2) Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution by Antony C. Sutton 165 pages https://www.voltairenet.org/IMG/pdf/Sut ... tion-5.pdf
3) Wall Street & the Rise of Hitler by Antony C. Sutton 148 pages https://www.voltairenet.org/IMG/pdf/Sut ... Hitler.pdf
4) Wall Street and FDR by Antony C. Sutton 177 pages http://sandiego.indymedia.org/media/2007/02/125049.pdf
5) Dishonest Money by Joseph Plummer 175 pages http://joeplummer.com/dishonest-money.html
6) None Dare Call it Conspiracy by Gary Allen 197 pages http://www.outpost-of-freedom.com/libra ... y_1971.pdf
David Rockefeller: Memoirs (The story of traitors)
http://www.devvy.com/pdf/2006_November/ ... rnment.pdf

User avatar
LKelly
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2012 10:35 pm

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by LKelly » Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:02 am

How low a pressure you can run really depends on the kind of 'wheeling you do, and your driving habits. I've gone as low as 5psi, but that is in the winter when there's little traction to be found...plus, I normally drive very slowly off-road. If you're the kind of guy who drives full-throttle, sliding sideways most of the time, I would stay at least up in the 20-25psi range. Actually, I'd probably go 25 psi just to be safe...I haven't lost a bead at that pressure yet, even doing some pretty hairy maneuvers at 70+ mph on the fire roads. You do lose a lot of clearance at the really low pressures, but depending on the terrain the added traction is well worth it. I air down a lot in snow or sand, but not as much in mud and packed dirt.

I have some friends who don't bother to air down, because they don't want to take the time to air back up - and in some situations I can get around better in two wheel drive than they can in four wheel drive...it can really make that much of a difference. There's a local hill around here that (as far as I know) my Power Wagon is the only truck that has been able to climb...but it wasn't good driving on my part, I just aired all the tires down to 5psi and crawled up it with the lockers engaged. Everyone else was hitting the hill at high speed and trying to make it up with momentum, but with the tires nearly flat I was able to use traction to make it to the top.

Sometimes airing down feels like cheating. :D

User avatar
stamm20
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 205
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 1:51 pm
Model Year: 2007
Location: Greenville, NC

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by stamm20 » Tue Mar 18, 2014 9:15 am

I ran mine at 12psi in the sand an had no problems with it
07 Brilliant Black Power Wagon
Current Mods: 35x12.50x17 Kelly Fierce Attitude M/T, DiabloSport Predator tuner, 3in Super 40 with 3in dump, TPS bypass, Pioneer touch screen Nav System with ipod hookup, Carli front diff gaurd, Fox adjustable steering stabilizer, Mopar steering box upgrade weathertec floor mats, Fox 2.0 performance shocks, hardwired lockers, evo swaybar disconnect



Yea Though I wheel through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil: For thou lockers are with me;
Thy lift and thy tires, they comfort me.
Thou preparest a spotter before me in the presence of mine obstacles

User avatar
chromedragon
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 144
Joined: Thu May 31, 2012 2:20 pm
Contact:

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by chromedragon » Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:22 pm

thank you all for the information. I can now go work with the tools and compressor to make sure i can air up and down on the trail before i get there
2006 Power Wagon Quad Cab Manual Moto Rims stock size, Cooper ATP, Dynatrac Ball joints, Dynatrac Free spin kit with Warn hubs, AmSteel blue 7/16 x 100' synthetics rope from Custom splice, Sony BT 602 stereo and backup camera etc. Rancho 9000XL adjustable shocks.

Special Licenses:
FAA Airframe and Power Plant
FCC Technician (Ham) KK6YCI

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
"No statement should be believed because it is made by an authority.

Robert A. Heinlein

User avatar
Chiprat1
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 122
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2012 7:42 pm

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by Chiprat1 » Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:46 pm

fbenross wrote:I run about a half pound less in the right rear to increase forward bite comin out of the corners.

:rockon: :excited: :idea: :popcorn:
2006 Power Wagon
Line X – 2in Front Leveler (Pro Comp), Hard wired Lockers, Front Fog Lights,
35in KM2’s, De-Politicized Winch (No LVI, Etc)
5th Wheel hitch

1980 CJ7 – Rino Lined, 33x12.50 Pro Comp AMC 360ci
1974 CJ7 – AMC 304ci, Beaten but fun “Brush Buggy”
Kaw Brute 650 – One Bad 4x4, winch, 12 lights

:winchmob:

User avatar
whitey
250_Posts
250_Posts
Posts: 369
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 9:26 am
Model Year: 2006
Location: Durham, North Carolina

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by whitey » Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:02 pm

I agree with all the above but the tire and the weight on each tire make a difference too. I am on sharp obstacles a lot so I make sure my tire can mold around the object without puncture but not so much that I loose too much clearance or pinch the tire hitting obstacles. I have a CO2 tank so I adjust on the fly. If I'm not getting the clearance I need then I go up a few pounds and I go down for traction. some brands I go down to 22lbs and some down to 27. Sand I go a lot lower, from 15 to 22 depending on the tire. I just picked up my 5th set of tires 10 days ago so I'm discovering what to do with em myself.

User avatar
fbenross
500_Posts
500_Posts
Posts: 593
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 8:35 pm
Location: Moss Beach CA

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by fbenross » Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:30 pm

This is what I use to air up or run air tools. Super - quality and reliability and it's portable.
Attachments
IMG_0891 (Large).JPG
Ben CW3 2/10th AIR CAV FT ORD CA. (retired)
2006 Power Wagon-6spd, rear air bags, Diff Guards:Carli F. RockCrusher R., matching rim for spare tire, removed back seat for storage----I own the following: 2005 Hallmark pop-top Camper---1970 Scout 800 4x4 w/232ci 6cyl 4spd---2006 Yamaha XT225 Dual Sport---Pictures @ https://www.flickr.com/photos/powerwagon/collections

User avatar
HammerTime
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 1:46 am
Model Year: 2017
Location: Lakeside CA

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by HammerTime » Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:58 am

In the sand dunes I've gone as low as 10 PSI with my Power Wagon, never lost a bead yet. (I have a few times on my Rubicon, but I take it down to 6/7 PSI.) So far I've been lucky, my air compressor has always been able to reseat my tires after blowing the seal.
2017 White/Black Power Wagon

Riznitch
Posts: 32
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2014 10:08 pm
Model Year: 2008

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by Riznitch » Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:17 pm

:lockedandloaded: Not to Hi-jack the thread but what about tire infiltrators. Not to get to expensive but just something to re-inflate after airing down. not really looking for a scuba tanks(sorry fbenross) Any recommendations?

Rich
2008 PW
White Knuckle rock rails, 5100 Bilstein 2-3", 5100 Bilstein front stabilizer, Super chip.

User avatar
whitey
250_Posts
250_Posts
Posts: 369
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 9:26 am
Model Year: 2006
Location: Durham, North Carolina

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by whitey » Fri Mar 21, 2014 8:39 pm

Actually the powertank works really well. CO2 goes into a liquid under pressure so its volume is deceiving. I don't think there's anything else that can air up a large tire as quick as a powertank. The negative is you need to know where to get it charged.

User avatar
Cactus Red
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1862
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 6:43 pm
Location: Chino Valley, AZ.

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by Cactus Red » Sat Mar 22, 2014 1:48 am

And cost per tire is really high with a CO2 system. I got roughly 24 tires per tank, at $18.00 per refill. Cost for the system is high too compared to an MV50 12v compressor. A CO2 setup will reseat a bead, but so will most compressors if used with a large ratchet strap around the tire and a can of foaming window cleaner to slick up the bead. That works pretty much 100% if only one bead is broken.

Sent via gigawatt laser...
I'm just along for the ride...

fyrfytr704
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 130
Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 10:21 pm
Model Year: 2008

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by fyrfytr704 » Sat Mar 22, 2014 8:50 am

I usually air down to about 20 PSI, depending on where I am going. Here's a little piece of gear that I've really liked for a lot of different reasons.

http://www.cloreautomotive.com/sku.php?id=245

It's a jump starter, 12v power source (nice for camping), and it's got a pretty nice built-in air compressor. The nice part is that it fits into my swing case, so it's not bouncing around somewhere in the truck. They're a little pricey compared to the jump packs you can find at Walmart or whatever, but they're professional quality.

When I ran my TJ Rubicon on tons and 40's I always used a CO2 tank, but that's because those tires took quite a bit to re-inflate when coming from 2PSI (beadlocks). For most uses, the jump pack with air compressor is more than you need and it's a bit faster than a lot of those cheap 12v pumps. The only downside is that you can't really power air tools with it.
2008 PW - stock with the exception of CAI, Superchips tune, LED tail lights, bed liner, tonneau cover, bed rug, swing case, and a black magic e-fan with override switch (for now). Now accepting donations for lift and tires!

User avatar
LKelly
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2012 10:35 pm

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by LKelly » Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:14 am

Before writing this post, I'd like to say that I just took a bunch of painkillers for a back problem...so I cannot be held responsible for anything I say. :)

Airing back up is something I've messed with quite a bit over the years, and it's one of those things where there really isn't any 'best' way to do it. Basically, your options are easy, fast, or cheap...and you can only ever have two out of the three. :) The high-pressure tanks are easy and fast, but they tend to be a bit pricey if you 'wheel a lot. If you want cheap and easy you can get one of the small MV-50 type compressors, which'll do the job but not very quickly. Plus, they tend to have a few 'quirks' and you might have to deal with on/off switches that stick, or oddball connectors, or things like that. For the most part, the cheaper compressors tend to be slower and need more maintenance, but since they're really simple devices it isn't a big deal. I've got one of the MV50s, plus I bought a Viair 70P about a year ago...the MV50 is a bit faster, but the Viair 70P seems to be higher quality.

Another option - if you have a large shop air compressor at home - is to just take a large portable air tank with you when you leave on a off-roading trip. It doesn't take long to fill it with a big compressor, and it'll hold enough air to pump your tires up to a 'safe' pressure for driving on the road. I did that for a long time, because it's faster than a portable air compressor and more reliable. A single 10-gallon tank was usually enough to air up the tires to drive on the road, though if I was going to drive higher speeds or longer distances I'd probably want to have 2 10-gallon tanks (one for each end). However, this only works for adding 10-20 pounds of air to each tire...if you air down to 10psi and want to go back up to 60psi you'll either need a powertank or a compressor (and a lot of patience).

Since my truck is really only used off-road, I've stopped even bothering to air back up - I just keep the speeds down to 45 mph or so on the way to and from the trail. I can get away with that around here since none of the roads have a higher than 55 mph speed limit, and our traffic is nearly non-existent - it isn't unusual not to see a single vehicle on the way out to the trail. If I lived in a place with more people, I'd have to figure something else out so that I didn't hold up traffic. Now instead of airing down for the trails, I keep the tires aired down and only air them up when I need to pull a trailer or haul a heavy load.

TwinStick
2000_Posts
2000_Posts
Posts: 4148
Joined: Mon May 28, 2012 7:58 pm
Model Year: 2008

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by TwinStick » Tue Mar 25, 2014 11:12 am

VERY well said LKelly ! :rockon:


:lol: This magical place that you speak of (no other vehicles & non-existant traffic & people)...........It's the Big Rock Candy Mountain, isn't it ?????? :lol:

:cheers:
In WNY State. 2008 Red QC PW G56. No lift yet, stock size tires. It pulls an 18' 2016 Starcraft AR One Extreme, 3500 lbs.
Load Pro 35 helper springs. 2015 A.R.E. MX Series custom cap. PCP front diff cover protector. Mag-Hytec 6 qt rear diff cover. K&N replacement air filter only. Dual grounded throttle body. Winch TPC bypass. Fab Four rear bumper. DURA BAK lined rocker protection. And a bunch of new front end stuff.

G-56 Gear ratios: 1st) 6.29:1 2nd) 3.48:1 3rd) 2.10:1 4th) 1.38:1 5th) 1.0:1 6th) 0.79:1 Rev 6.29:1 --- = 78.01613:1 Crawl Ratio
-------------------------5.94:1--------3.28:1-------1.98:1-------1.31:1-------1.0:1-------0.74:1-----5.42:1 ---- = 73.675:1
545RFE----------------3.0:1---------1.67:1--------1.0:1--------0.75:1-------0.67:1------------------3.0:1 -------=37.21:1

2013+ 32.47 crawl ratio...............Can you see the trend ??????????????

User avatar
LKelly
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 92
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2012 10:35 pm

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by LKelly » Wed Mar 26, 2014 1:24 am

TwinStick wrote:VERY well said LKelly ! :rockon:
Thanks...most of my best writing is when I'm highly medicated. :D
TwinStick wrote: :lol: This magical place that you speak of (no other vehicles & non-existant traffic & people)...........It's the Big Rock Candy Mountain, isn't it ?????? :lol:
:lol: Well, I suppose it's about the closest you can get east of the Mississippi...but it isn't quite like some of the areas I've been out west. When I was out in Wyoming 20 years ago I went some places that make the upper peninsula of Michigan seem downright civilized. :)

Fireman78
50_Posts
50_Posts
Posts: 154
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 9:07 am
Location: Tijeras, NM USA

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by Fireman78 » Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:46 pm

I went down to 12 ish PSI after getting stuck (with a 16' trailer") is super deep sand. Worked like a charm. I also have the deflators which is nice! The military ones are the best ones IMHO. Took FOREVER to refill tires though with small portable compressor . Now I have a badass onboard air system. Worth every penny.. :D
Enjoy this life, cause it's all we're getting.

User avatar
FirerescuePW
1000_Posts
1000_Posts
Posts: 1577
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 12:51 pm
Location: North Wales, PA

Re: Airing down how low?

Post by FirerescuePW » Thu Mar 27, 2014 11:35 am

Do tell about these military deflators. Where would one procure said devices?

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk
'05 Mineral Gray Power Wagon QC #1005

WINCH MOB PROUD!

SuperChips FlashPaq; DT ProFab Steering Brace; 08.5 Steering linkage (twice); Toyo Open Country M/T 35/12.50x17; Carli front diff guard; Rockcrusher rear diff cover; White Knuckle Offroad Rock Rails; Carli 3"coils, track bar, and High Clearance Control Arms; Carli King 2.5" Remote Resi Shocks; Reflex spray-in liner; Extang Trifecta tonneau cover; Pop Lock electric tailgate lock (OOS); Tekonsha Prodigy brake control; LEDS & Strobes & Siren; Winch TPS Bypass; Warn Wireless Remote; Dog hair, and a BIG Wish List!

Post Reply